need help with ToM bridge studs! [update: pictorial!]

[kboman]

Friends, help! I am in despair! :sad:

I went ahead and bought the Schaller LP vibrato bridge for my Hagström. It looks great, but there's a snag - because of some arcane Stupidity, the size of the bridge studs and threaded inserts are much smaller on the new bridge than the old one.

Here's the technical drawing of the bridge, with the stud and insert in the lower left corner, they are dimensioned like these:

...whereas the existing bridge stuff is dimensioned like this:

After a brief period of Depression and Despair, I was cheered up by the idea of mounting the bridge to my Schecter, thus getting some actual use out of that guitar (meeting kittens helped as well) - but it was the same thing there. Big, fat stuff where I need thin and small.

So... I need some help. What I really need to make my life Much Better is one of those big insert thingies with a small M6 hole, not the usual wider one. Does such a thing exist? Or are there other ways around this? Callaham has something they call "Nashville conversion studs" but I'm not sure they would stand up to vibratoing in the long term. I also realise that I can plug the existing holes and drill new ones, but I'd really rather not.


PS. Apparently these ToM version are called "ABR-1" and "Nashville" for no discernible reason. After two days of looking at this stuff I still have no idea which is which: one is simply expected to know, through divine inspiration or something.

 

[kboman]

Really, no one here can help?

Here's a photo of the actual parts in question:

The stud and inserts from Schaller are at the top, then we have the installed TonePros threaded insert and accompanying stud, shown here unscrewed for purposes of demonstration. What would sove all my problems and make me a seriously happy camper is an insert of TonePros size but with a Schaller size hole, but I'm open to any solution that lets me use the vibrato bridge as intended.

(I don't know the correct engineering terms for these parts, but I hope I make some kind of sense)

 

[Superlizard]

:icon_scratch:

Only solutions I can think of are:

a)  Send the unit back and get a simliar one (if such exists) that fits your studs

b)  Call up someone like Callaham and have them custom machine you a pair
    of inserts which will fit both ends - prolly cost ya though

 

[mayfly]

if it were me I'd find a local machine shop to turn down the larger part. 

Either that or pull the old stud, plug the hole, and re-drill (and hope the new part covers the scar). 

I'd go to the machine shop first.  General Grinding in beautiful Hintonberg.  :headbang:

 

[kboman]

The only option I feel would work for me right now is to install the smaller inserts in a couple of plugs and install those into the guitar without glue. That way I can keep looking for something that will work better. If I really can't find anything I'll have something made, but I won't order what amounts to 2 cubic cms of metal from another continent :icon_biggrin:

Callaham makes these studs... so close...!

 

[OzziePete]

I saw this Thread yesterday & thought I had seen some adapter stud bushings from a place like Stew Mac or Allparts, but I went trawling through there and couldn't find them now.

I *think* these adapter stud bushings were to fit a thin bolt from the bridge into a thicker socket stud bushing, or adapt the bigger stud hole into a smaller one,  but it was a while ago and I have no idea what their dimensions were. I wouldn't hold your hopes up that they are available nowadays.

Maybe someone like Dangerous R6 could give you an idea of who to approach in your locale - a machine engineering shop of some sort, I guessing?  :dontknow:

 

[leo12.]

Looking at the drawing for the schaller bridge it has a 6.5mm diameter for a stud mount. Check  Stewmac for TonePros locking studs item
# 5634 or # 5635-N. These studs have a 6.223 diameter  to fit on the schaller bridge & will lock down. You will have to take the original stud
from the Hagstrom to see if it is a metric m8 (#5635) or US 5/16-24 (#5634).  If you get an m8 nut & the stud treads in you need the metric
one (my money is on the metric size). good luck.

 

[mayfly]

another thought would be to drill out your TOM bridge to suit the part - that would work as well.

 

[CrackedPepper]

That was my thought as well if he has a drill press

 

[leo12.]

If the bridge is drilled (NOT RECOMMENDED) the original studs from the Hagstrom do NOT have the facility to lock down on the bridge.
It will imo (not speaking from experence) need to lock for stability.

 

[kboman]

Damn, I'm too exhausted from work these days to do something constructive about this right now, but I am very grateful for your support guys!
Wow, how's this for "close but no cigar"! http://www.thomann.de/gb/goeldo_bridge_adapter_m4_m8.htm

Looking at the drawing for the schaller bridge it has a 6.5mm diameter for a stud mount. Check  Stewmac for TonePros locking studs item  # 5634 or # 5635-N. These studs have a 6.223 diameter  to fit on the schaller bridge & will lock down. You will have to take the original stud from the Hagstrom to see if it is a metric m8 (#5635) or US 5/16-24 (#5634).  If you get an m8 nut & the stud treads in you need the metric one (my money is on the metric size). good luck.

I had a look at these, but they seem to be for tail pieces only Also, the studs need to be M6/6 mm in diameter.

Drilling: I have zero tools beyond the most basic and no applicable experience with anything larger than a hand drill. Drilling the bridge is probably not a good idea anyway...

 

[OzziePete]

Have you thought of taking the problem to a good guitar repairer? I know they are hard to find, but maybe ask around and someone in your local region might have a good reputation... :dontknow:

 

[leo12.]

k
If you want to use the Schaller bridge on the Hagstrom you will need the parts mentioned earlier. If you look at stewmac it says
"Retrofit  your WRAPAROUND  BRIDGE OR STOP TAILPIECE for better tone and sustain! Your BRIDGE OR TAILPIECE WILL
NO LONGER LEAN, resulting in more STABILITY and improved string energy transfer"
This bridge needs to be locked leaving the tail to move.
The threaded STUDS in the pic shows the M6 at top by SCHALLER & your Hagstrom STUDS (NOT LOCKING) BUT VISIBLY LARGER M8.
THE PART TO GO INTO THE BUSHINGS IN THE HAGSTROM NEEDS TO BE M8 WITH A 6.223 COLLER TO SLIDE INTO THE
SCHALLER BRIDGE 6.5 opening &  BE LOCKED TO THESE M8 STUDS.
What looks like the parts you need at Thormann are #41284 (they do NOT supply a drawing for these parts also not in stock) .

 

[kboman]

Have you thought of taking the problem to a good guitar repairer? I know they are hard to find, but maybe ask around and someone in your local region might have a good reputation... :dontknow:

I have, and I know a very very good one very close to me who is currently working on my old acoustic. I've been putting off getting in touch with him because this is such a minor issue and because I basically have close to zero opportunities to visit his store/workshop without taking time off from work. Given that it seems hopeless to find a part on my own, I'll probably have to send him en email soon anyway.

k
If you want to use the Schaller bridge on the Hagstrom you will need the parts mentioned earlier. If you look at stewmac it says
"Retrofit  your WRAPAROUND  BRIDGE OR STOP TAILPIECE for better tone and sustain! Your BRIDGE OR TAILPIECE WILL
NO LONGER LEAN, resulting in more STABILITY and improved string energy transfer"
This bridge needs to be locked leaving the tail to move.
The threaded STUDS in the pic shows the M6 at top by SCHALLER & your Hagstrom STUDS (NOT LOCKING) BUT VISIBLY LARGER M8.
THE PART TO GO INTO THE BUSHINGS IN THE HAGSTROM NEEDS TO BE M8 WITH A 6.223 COLLER TO SLIDE INTO THE
SCHALLER BRIDGE 6.5 opening &  BE LOCKED TO THESE M8 STUDS.
What looks like the parts you need at Thormann are #41284 (they do NOT supply a drawing for these parts also not in stock) .

Well yes, I know all of this. I do appreciate all attempts to help, but I'm not sure where you are going with the above (or the CAPITALISATION).
Thomann is giving me grief about finding that part, but I haven't given up on it yet.

 

[leo12.]

k
i used caps to highlight the parts & size descriptions in that the studs as you described in your (4th post looked like tailpiece studs only) which i
agree that is probabaly where they are used the most.
I think  any mods filling re drilling would devalue your guitar & leave you with signs of modification & if the bridge was not for you returning it to
standard would be back to filling , drilling etc.
I would be interested in how the bridge mod works out  & your review/ opinions i've not seen one fitted before.
on a lighter note (all lower case).