Need help preventing ski jumps

[benbreard]

Alright, I feel like I'm going crazy. I've been playing for ~30 years, have a bunch of guitars, and generally know what I'm doing. ......but now I'm starting to lose my confidence because I *keep* getting ski jumps on my necks. I've now had 5 Warmoth necks develop this and a super nice Tom Anderson. There is nothing less satisfying for me to play than a guitar where a high fret is chocking out the notes. I hate that sound!!

Anyway, it's been so many that I'm starting to think I'm the problem. I like in the Dallas area, and I monitor teperature & moisture, I do use nice wall hangers - which I wouldn't think would cause this. I don't crank down on the neck pocket screws. I *have* done the thing where you slightly loosen the screws with the guitar strung to get a tighter fit on the neck. I wouldn't think that would cause the issue, but I'm now questioning everything. Why does this keep happening to me?! I wouldn't think 10s or 9.5 strings are particularly hard on the instrument.

This is top of mind because I had a nice warmoth strat where the neck developed a terrible ski jump and after wasting $250 to get the frets leveled to compensate it sucked and all the mojo was gone - felt like a frettless wonder up high, but in a really terrible way. Anyway, I replaced this neck w/ a really nice padauk one and it was perfect for 2 years. Then slowly but surely the slappy sound came back and I noticed I my fret rocker was clicking up high. I just paid $300 to plek it and SOB this neck developed the same ski jump as the rest. I'm sad, pissed, frustrated, and I just feel like all the $$$ I've spent w/ Warmoth is just throwing good after bad.

What am I doing wrong? Please help me. ...and thanks for listening

 

[TBurst Std]

Please explain the science of loosening something to make it tighter? You’re all over the place in what you are saying.

 

[teleme01]

Sounds like bridge is a touch low or the neck doesn't have enough relief? But then I am a dumb ass and I am merely guessing.

 

[stratamania]

Perhaps the necks are being overtightened into the pocket.

 

[benbreard]

Please explain the science of loosening something to make it tighter? You’re all over the place in what you are saying.

Sorry, I didn't explain it well. This video is what I'm talking about:

He rambles a bit so I would play it at 2x speed

 

[benbreard]

Perhaps the necks are being overtightened into the pocket.

I suspect you may be right. I never felt like I was cranking down on the screws a bunch, but. <Shrug>

How tight do you normally make yours? I don't suppose loosening them a tiny bit would reduce the problem, or would it?

 

[Spud]

I like to create a bit of fall away , and tighten the neck screws by hand, tight, but not insane tight. Live in Pacific northwest weather, case or bag them and never had that problem.

 

[NutBehindTheGuitar]

Hi
What kind of wood are your necks? Both shaft and fretboard? I live in the swamp city of Houston TX. I get all my necks in roasted maple (shaft wood) because of my fear of neck warping.
My guitars are all out on stands, however here in the swamp it's super humid in summertime and just regular humid the rest of the year, so wood never gets a chance to dry out here like it does in places with a change of seasons.

I don't think that the problem has anything to do with the neck screws.
Bye

 

[JohnnyHardtail]

I also want to ask about the woods these neck are made from. I found a tendancy for some necks to develop a "S" shape with a bump around the 15th fret. I experienced this with two Warmoth modern construction necks in the past. The 1st neck was remedied using PLEK, which solved that particular issue. The second neck was only borderline problematic, so I simply adjust the action a bit higher and use lighter strings.

I'm pedantic about having flat and stable necks, so there are 2 things i like to do:
1) When reasonably possible, I like to store the guitar in a case when it is not being used.
2) Choose necks made from roasted maple for the best flatness with no ski jumps.

Single acting truss-rod installation has a triangulated position, so may be better aligned to withstand shear-stress IMO.

 

[stratamania]

I suspect you may be right. I never felt like I was cranking down on the screws a bunch, but. <Shrug>

How tight do you normally make yours? I don't suppose loosening them a tiny bit would reduce the problem, or would it?

I tighten them so they are snug, but don't overtighten them.

You could try loosening the screws in your necks if they are really cranked down.

Like @Spud on necks, I tend to put a little fall away on the higher frets when doing fretwork.

 

[benbreard]

Thanks all for the feedback and thoughts - I very much appreciate the thoughts!

I like to create a bit of fall away , and tighten the neck screws by hand, tight, but not insane tight. Live in Pacific northwest weather, case or bag them and never had that problem.

Same regarding fall away. I can get that, but then a few years later, it's moot because the wood moves. :/ I really don't want to case my guitars, but maybe that's part of the solution.

What kind of wood are your necks? Both shaft and fretboard? I live in the swamp city of Houston TX.

I'll try to remember them all - I'm fuzzy on the dates. I baby my guitars but I did gig with a pretty good amount with these:
Maple/Maple, standard thin, modern construction, gunstock oil finish 2006? gave away it got so bad
Birdseye maple w/ skunk stripe, fatback, vintage modern, satin factory finish. massive ski jump, upper frets almost erased after leveling - sold to a cowboy chord guy for almost nothing.
Roasted maple, std thin, vintage modern, no finish 2019? - still good! but cannot get the action as low as after the plek. The wood has moved some.
Paduak/Ebony, std thin, vintage modern, no finish - 2018? - still playable but becoming problematic and slappy. super sad about this one because it was a favorite of mine for about 5 years
Paduak/Pau Ferro, std thin, vintage modern, no finish 2022 - just had the plek and am still pretty upset that it's getting the same ski jump.

Tom Anderson cobra mahogany/Rosewood - 2017 - I'm super grateful that Tom made me a new neck and the guitar is perfect now.

You could try loosening the screws in your necks if they are really cranked down.

I checked the tightness of the screws this morning and they don't feel super tight to me. I *can* be an over-tightener, but after checking I don't *think* this is the issue. ....but let's be honest, I'm the common denominator here. It's got to be me right?

 

[supertruper1988]

Ski jumps are super common on any bolt on enough that most tech will just level in a fall off on those frets when doing a level/crown/polish or a refret on a bolt on.

 

[teleme01]

Just passing thoughts, would over tightening put pressure on the fretboard which over time may be the cause?

 

[Spud]

I also want to ask about the woods these neck are made from. I found a tendancy for some necks to develop a "S" shape with a bump around the 15th fret. I experienced this with two Warmoth modern construction necks in the past. The 1st neck was remedied using PLEK, which solved that particular issue. The second neck was only borderline problematic, so I simply adjust the action a bit higher and use lighter strings.

I'm pedantic about having flat and stable necks, so there are 2 things i like to do:
1) When reasonably possible, I like to store the guitar in a case when it is not being used.
2) Choose necks made from roasted maple for the best flatness with no ski jumps.

Single acting truss-rod installation has a triangulated position, so may be better aligned to withstand shear-stress IMO.

"triangulated"?!!! look at the big brain on Johnathon!

 

[benbreard]

Ski jumps are super common on any bolt on enough that most tech will just level in a fall off on those frets when doing a level/crown/polish or a refret on a bolt on.

So do you think what I'm experiencing is just normal and to be expected? I won't like it if that's the case, but...... I guess every single Warmoth neck I've purchased has ski jumped over time. That's a bummer.

 

[benbreard]

Also, I do want to be fair. I love Warmoth and, when they my guitars are at their best, they are incredible. I don't want to sound like I'm raging on the company - I just want to solve the problem.

 

[stratamania]

....but let's be honest, I'm the common denominator here. It's got to be me right?

When there are other possible variables, to speculate that commonality equals causality would be illogical.

 

[supertruper1988]

So do you think what I'm experiencing is just normal and to be expected? I won't like it if that's the case, but...... I guess every single Warmoth neck I've purchased has ski jumped over time. That's a bummer.

I personally dont experience this as much because I dont run a super low action. If I did then it would be a bigger problem for me. Its really all about setting your expectations to match the situation. Could you raise your string height a few thousandths to get over the last fret? simply file the last fret a little more? There are a few solutions that dont make this as hopeless as you spell out here.

 

[teleme01]

Just passing thoughts, would over tightening put pressure on the fretboard which over time may be the cause?

Quoting myself, but if a neck screws is applying pressure to the fretboard, could this be a consideration of causing a ski ramp?

 

[NutBehindTheGuitar]

Hey Ben

First of I feel your pain, never lost a guitar to neck problems, but did lose one to a hurricane and that still stings.

I think you should thoroughly investigate the range of humidity where you live. I know Dallas has an actual winter, sometimes with snow, does the humidity really drop in winter for several weeks?
I don't know the numbers but in Houston because of our closeness to the Gulf of Mexico (and it will always be the Gulf of Mexico) the humidity level never really crashes all the way down.

If the humidity level in Dallas is really that variable I think you should find a way to humidify the room where you keep your guitars.

Hope this helps