Good alternate neck woods for Alder Strat

[redstrat87]

I have a Strat and I like my pickups (I custom modified them to my dream tone), but I wish the guitar had a softer attack, deeper bass, and more mids.  I presume the culprit is the maple neck.  I was thinking of investing in a Les Paul, but this Strat has significant sentimental value.  The only thing that is not original is the neck so I was thinking about replacing the neck to give the Strat more warmth...  Plus a new neck may be cheaper than a whole new guitar anyways

With wood combinations, I read that not everything works in real life as they may seem on paper / in theory e.g. I don't see too many Mahogany necks on Alder bodies.  So does anyone know any good neck woods that pair well with Alder bodies?  Besides maple of course

I was curious about Korina / Limba...  or Wenge... P.S. mostly play blues, jazz, and classic rock.

Thanks

 

[AutoBat]

I don't see too many Mahogany necks on Alder bodies.

That's exactly what I have with my 93/94 MIM Strat.
I didn't really notice any tonal difference from the maple/maple OEM neck that it had.
There's great debate on what changes tones on guitars. Taken as a whole it seems the pickups effect it the most and usually the neckwood/fretboard second.
I couldn't tell you if the ebony fretboard counteracts the mahogany. I might not be super picky about it.  I defy you to find a wood combination made by W that isn't superb.
On my VIP (chambered mahogany w/maple cap) I've got a Wenge/Bloodwood neck.

They've both got thicker than "standard thin" necks (59 Roundback on the Strat, SRV on the VIP). They fit my hands better than what the MIM Strat OEM neck did (and much better than the thin yamaha strat I had before that).
If you haven't seen the neck wood page, it's here: http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/Necks/NeckWoods.aspx
Gonçalo Alves would probably steer you in the right direction.  All rosewood is another great option.
Consider an exotic neck that doesn't require a finish.  Often the price of a mahogany/maple/koa neck with a finish is just about the same price as an exotic neck without a finish.
While we're here: Stainless steel frets. You want them. Locking tuners are also a plus.  And for what it's worth gold hardware looks terrible on almost everything.

Here's my before/after shot the day I got my neck (late Jan 2010)

 

[Updown]

Hi and welcome.  :icon_biggrin:

You could just change your pickups, but you said you like them.

I have a Alder Strat with quilt maple top with a RAW Pau-Ferro / Ebony neck. Standard thin.
(thats about the closest to Maple I have)
This has TOM string though with 2 x Bare Knuckle Humbucker pups.
Love everything about that one, perfect combo !!

I have a another Alder Strat with quilt maple  top with a RAW Indian Rosewood / Indian Rosewood neck 59'
This has 2 x P-Rails with a GK-3 (was 6 hole trem) now with a scartozi bridge.
This is much more warmer than the above one …. Noticeably !!

Never tried any other necks on those, thou.
Both have SS frets and both very smooth and fast to play on.

So Rosewood or Indian Rosewood is warm.
Might be to warm for you going from Maple.  :dontknow:
Mid range tonal woods may be best for you to be looking at.

I'd probably lean towards Wenge / Ebony, which would be warmer than Maple.
But … there are other woods in that mid tonal range too.
ie: Goncalo Alves, Canery, Bocote, Bubinga, Kingwood
Here ...
http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/Necks/NeckWoods.aspx

BTW …  I can play blues, jazz and rock, or even anything on any neck.  :icon_biggrin:

 

[crash]

Wenge / Ebony is a good choice, so is Goncalo Alves / Pau Ferro.  Those seem to be the 2 most popular combinations for neck wood at Warmoth, and for good reason.

I would suggest rolling back the tone knob from 10 to about 6-7.  This will knock that resonance peak flat making a much smoother sound.  See below

 

[m4rk0]

based on this experiment,

when I switched from:

to

it was just a different guitar!!! night and day difference it tone!! (not to mention feel)

so Rosewood with ebony FB is the way to go!

 

[redstrat87]

There's great debate on what changes tones on guitars. Taken as a whole it seems the pickups effect it the most and usually the neckwood/fretboard second.

Yes, I agree.  I had a Maple neck on a Mahogany body and I couldn't tell it was Mahogany.  It had mids like a Mahogany body, but everything else was bright and snappy like a Fender.  The smoothness, lower-mid girth, punchy bass, Mahogany snarl, was all tamed into oblivion...

For acoustics, I noticed that the back and sides have subtle differences (nonetheless, more noticable than electric solid bodies) in comparison to the waist clinch, body depth, and of course, top wood.  However, I saw a guitar with near identical construction EXCEPT had some sorta neck wood that I never heard of (supposedly really hard and bright like Maple).  The neck changed the guitar soooo much compared to the similar build w/ a Mahogany neck.

And IMHO, tone's greatest factor is actually the amp, particularly the speakers...  Listen to a speaker comparison on YouTube. Its crazy how DIFFERENT they sound.  Much more different than different PAF style pickups sound from each other...

I couldn't tell you if the ebony fretboard counteracts the mahogany.

I think it compliments it well.  I have a lot of experience with Gibson style guitars (thats why I'm struggling with this Strat which I love nonetheless), and when I got a Mahogany guitar w/ Ebony FB, it was perfect!  Some woods just pair together better.  My experience w/ Maple neck and Mahogany body was terrible :\  ...I even forgave and tried it TWICE and was disappointed again XD

Gonçalo Alves would probably steer you in the right direction.  All rosewood is another great option.

Yes, I was also considering Goncalo if its middy and warm and pairs well w/ Alder... but couldn't find any people's testimonies or demos on YouTube.  But yah, I don't wanna do guess work on a Warmoth project... an expensive gamble lol.  Research is key. Knowledge = power.

And from my experience, Rosewood has scooped mids (at least in comparison to Maple which is upper-mid friendly) w/ some lower mids.  Warm lows and smooth highs, but scooped mids, which isn't what I want   Otherwise, I'd jumped on that ASAP!  I do want a Rosewood fretboard of course for the smooth highs  

Here's my before/after shot the day I got my neck (late Jan 2010)

Wow! Congrats   She's a looker!  I love dark colored natural finish necks on Strats ~  wait, I lie... I meant on ANY guitar, haha!

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Hi and welcome.  :icon_biggrin:

You could just change your pickups, but you said you like them.

Thank you for the welcome.  I am surprise at the responses already.  So quick, informative, and polite.

And yah, I love my pickups.  I tried doing the "change pickup" route and went w/ Alnico II Pros (sc and hum) but I don't like the sound of Alnico IIs.  I prefer the sound of Alnico IIIs in neck/middle and Alnico V (with a lower pot value) in the bridge.  They sound particularly killer on Gibson style guitars, but I don't like their fb radius, nut width and/or neck contours, they seem heavier on my back haha, and I like the tone of 25.5" scale necks more and also provides better stability for drop tuning / alternative tuning.  The Strat was perfect for me...  but just needed more mids is all. 

If I had all the money in the world, I'd get a Chambered Korina Strat w/ a Korina neck and Rosewood fretboard.  The 25.5" scale length will make sure it doesnt get TOO warm haha   If not, maybe Pau Ferro fretboard instead lol.  But I want to keep the original body and hardware of my Strat.  It has history, ya know?  The stock neck has bad frets and a jammed truss rod which needed to be used so thats why I'm willing to replace the neck.  Right now, I'm playing a Mighty Mite for the time being, but honestly, its a really nice neck haha just needs some smoothening on the frets (which I wont do cos I don't mind rough frets ).  Surprisingly, perfect intonation and no buzz at all

I have a another Alder Strat with quilt maple  top with a RAW Indian Rosewood / Indian Rosewood neck 59'
This has 2 x P-Rails with a GK-3 (was 6 hole trem) now with a scartozi bridge.
This is much more warmer than the above one …. Noticeably !!

Do you have any clips with this guitar?  I would love to hear it.  I figured that Rosewood necks would sound kinda mid-scooped but I guess I have to hear it to see how it behaves as a neck shaft...

I'd probably lean towards Wenge / Ebony, which would be warmer than Maple.
But … there are other woods in that mid tonal range too.
ie: Goncalo Alves, Canery, Bocote, Bubinga, Kingwood
Here ...
http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/Necks/NeckWoods.aspx

Thank you.  I have read Warmoth's info many times for the last many years lol even before the new website layout and everything haha.  But it never says much about what woods pair well w/ which "body" woods; they only mention shaft/fb combinations.

BTW …  I can play blues, jazz and rock, or even anything on any neck.  :icon_biggrin:

Lol well I CAN'T play blues, jazz, and rock on ANY neck >__<  lol jk haha.  Naw, I'm not too shabby myself.  Its just when I get extra cash, I occasionally quest for better gear even though I'm pretty content after many years of adventuring lol. 

---------

Wenge / Ebony is a good choice, so is Goncalo Alves / Pau Ferro.  Those seem to be the 2 most popular combinations for neck wood at Warmoth, and for good reason.

I would suggest rolling back the tone knob from 10 to about 6-7.  This will knock that resonance peak flat making a much smoother sound.  See below

Awesome, thank you for the specific advice.  Do you have any personal experience with this combination on Alder body?  I know some things look good on paper but don't turn up well real life...

Haha well I'm very interactive with my controls.  I'm not one of those people who leaves their knobs dimed.  The treble knob works with the resistance which sonically translates to increasing/decreasing the higher frequencies.  It does not touch the mids.  But yes, in perception, eliminating certain frequencies will accentuate others and make them "appear" to be there, but my ear is a little bit more stubborn then that.  Rolling down trebles won't give me a warm midrange cause in reality, theres no mids to begin with, and I just end up with less treble.  However, changing to Alnico III a few years ago really helped.  Has a nice deep bass and smooth highs. Also slightly less mid scoop than A5 (other words, more mids ), yet doesn't compress so too easily like A2s which in my opinion, may sound nasally in the wrong guitar...   
-----

based on this experiment,

it was just a different guitar!!! night and day difference it tone!! (not to mention feel)

so Rosewood with ebony FB is the way to go!

Nice axe!  I love single hum guitars   Do you have any sound clips of this baby?

-----

Anyway, if I find no luck... I might just go try an Alnico amp speaker.  Right now I have a Ceramic and I think maybe the speaker can be a variable towards what I tonally desire.

Thanks everyone for the help    And keep em coming!  I love hearing about personal experience and maybe, sound clips???

 

[redstrat87]

Sorry for the double post but I just did more research.  IDK why but some reason I never considered a Rosewood neck... I think something in the past made me steer away.  Something tramatic and repressed into the darkest depths of my subconscious? Lol

Anyway I found this link: http://youtu.be/9LLn8cgEjtE

An all rosewood neck on an Alder Strat sounds awesome! Though this is a Brazilian Rosewood which is supposedly a little brighter, but IDK how much brighter.  Nonetheless, this Rosewood neck isn't too warm yet noticably warmer (not extreme, just moderately, but I didn't want too much difference, just the right amount).

This would be perfect for me   Thanks guys for heading me to the right direction!

If you guys know anyone selling a Warmoth Vintage Modern Rosewood shaft neck (FB preferably anything woody that looks sexy: Rosewood, Pau Ferro, Kingwood, Wenge, etc. P.S. Ebony isn't my cup of tea), let me know please  

Thanks!

 

[MSP]

All-rosewood is my fave neck.  I prefer Brazilian, but that's very tough to get hold of now.  I wouldn't say Brazilian is brighter than Indian.  I'd say it's more chime-y.  It's not really more treble-y, it's kinda more detailed, IMO. 

 

[Kostas]

... The only thing that is not original is the neck so I was thinking about replacing the neck to give the Strat more warmth...

You haven't mentioned which amp(s) & drive pedal(s) you have. If you want more warmth I would look at the amp, not the neck. A neck will change your sound but you don't know in which direction and maybe not so much as you expect. You can check my post here http://www.unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=872.msg261347#msg261347 about changing the neck in my stat. If you decide to change it I suggest the thickest shape you can handle and SS frets. Also, I find the satin finish Warmoth is doing excellent and I like it as much as my unfinished necks.

Finally, don't take a decision based on a YT clip. The guy is a very good played (he sounds good in all clips), the pickups in this strat are different than in yours and he is probably using different amp/cab/speakers than you.

 

[redstrat87]

All-rosewood is my fave neck.  I prefer Brazilian, but that's very tough to get hold of now.  I wouldn't say Brazilian is brighter than Indian.  I'd say it's more chime-y.  It's not really more treble-y, it's kinda more detailed, IMO.

Thank you for the info.  I much appreciate it and I know what you mean   Maybe I'll get a hold of Madagascar if I do get a neck.  I like the grain better than Indian and from what I have read several times, in comparison to Indian, its more similar to Brazilian.

You haven't mentioned which amp(s) & drive pedal(s) you have. If you want more warmth I would look at the amp, not the neck.

You're correct about the amp.  Yah, earlier I stated that I will probably look at an Alnico speaker.  I'm thinking Marshall-y.  But then I stumbled on this clip of a Rosewood neck and it was beautiful.  Got swept away lol sorry if I got carried away!  So if the speaker solution doesn't do the trick, maybe I'll invest in a Rosewood neck too...

Btw, I use a Vox clone amp (similar to an AC15), HT-Drive pedal or sometimes a fuzz (I have a few), and reverb.

I think the speaker swap will def do the job though. My speaker is pretty Voxy / bright in nature. Still love it though Weber \m/

Finally, don't take a decision based on a YT clip. The guy is a very good played (he sounds good in all clips), the pickups in this strat are different than in yours and he is probably using different amp/cab/speakers than you.

Yah Phil is pretty badass.  I've seen quite a few of his videos.  He was using a Vox in that demo btw...  And I can gauge the tone from this Strat in comparison to different Strats and apply it to my guitar.  From different single coil Strats, the Rosewood neck Strat is warmer, but not drastically, just enough.  The subtle differences in different single coils of the same magnet and general style/wound is really hard for me to tell over YouTube / computer, but at least I get a general idea.

Anyway, I think YT can be very useful for general knowledge.  Better than reading about it... or running around spending hundreds, if thousands, of bucks on experimentation.  I think a little audio research before experimentation is reasonable

 

[Kostas]

The classic Vox sound comes from the Blue. There are quality Alnico speakers from Scumback, WGS, ASW. All are expensive compared to ceramics. If you want high gain I suggest the Jensen Blackbird, it's very good for clean, high gain and everything between. Versatile and warm sounding speaker.

In my strat the maple/pau ferro gave me more detail in the note than the rosewood neck. I wouldn't go back to an all rosewood neck.

 

[redstrat87]

The classic Vox sound comes from the Blue. There are quality Alnico speakers from Scumback, WGS, ASW. All are expensive compared to ceramics. If you want high gain I suggest the Jensen Blackbird, it's very good for clean, high gain and everything between. Versatile and warm sounding speaker.

In my strat the maple/pau ferro gave me more detail in the note than the rosewood neck. I wouldn't go back to an all rosewood neck.

Thank you so much for all the info.  Yah, I think its better to change the speaker instead in case I need some of that bite from the Maple neck or open presence in my cleans.  I do love how the bridge pickup sounds, just wish the neck pickup had more mids, softer attack, and deeper bass.  I guess I'll use my thumb more often for picking even though I'm not as dexterous with it haha

I currently have a Weber Blue Dog in my amp.  Its my practice/recording amp.  I was thinking about a Sliver Bell and switch between speakers whenever I want for recording sessions.  But IDK if the Alnico version would be too compressed... :\ 

And thank you, I'll check out the Jensen Blackbird   Would you recommend that speaker w/ ceramic or alnico?  I have absolutely NO experience w/ Alnico speakers

 

[Kostas]

...And thank you, I'll check out the Jensen Blackbird   Would you recommend that speaker w/ ceramic or alnico?  I have absolutely NO experience w/ Alnico speakers

The http://www.jensentone.com/speaker/12_blackbird is an alnico 100 watt speaker. It may suit you as it's a warm speaker, some people find it too warm and they pair it with a different speaker. Personally I can't find any speaker to be too warm as I like a warm fat round sound. If anything is too warm the EQ can fix it. Google it, you will find threads in many guitar forums. I have seen it installed from Soldanos and Egnaters to vintage Fenders. It's the only 100 watt alnico and can handle high gain well unlike most alnico speakers.

A ceramic warm speaker is the Cannabis Rex http://www.eminence.com/speakers/speaker-detail/?model=Cannabis_Rex Cheaper than the Blackbird, 50 watts. I have seen it mostly in vintage Fenders, installed to tame the highs. You may try it and see if you like it. It's easier to find it used than the Blackbird.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

Seriously if it's just the neck pickup you want to be warmer, why not just switch the pickup? It's much easier, and much cheaper, and you'll almost certainly get exactly what you want. You're about to spend a fortune because you've eliminated the pickup swap option for sentimental reasons.

You could try, say, a Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro in there.

 

[eugene-ej]

I have assembled alder soloist body with a canary (wolfgang profile neck) and it's appeared a really great combination! I have another guitar: ash+maple top body superstat and maple+rosewood neck. It has great highs and hi-mids, but it's missing low-mids and lows, no balls in sound.

When I tried first time alder+canary - I was so excited! It has spark in a sound, but it's a bit softer that with maple neck. It has LOWS, closer to low-mids! I feel how guitar is resonating in my hands, sound has very strong balls, it's punchy, but not muddy at all. Attack is well defined. I got exactly what I wanted.

I will compare my guitar with another alder+maple strat later, when I get it finished. But I can tell for sure that Canary neck is a great match for an alder body for a balanced and powerful sound.

 

[Ddbltrbl]

Another option you might consider if the color will work is Purpleheart! I find the tone to be very similar to the Wenge/Ebony combo.  :dontknow: