Leaderboard

Do I just get the creeps too easy, or is this really creepy?

S

stubhead

Master Member
Messages
4,669
(wear your rubber waders an' bring the shovel) - >

http://www.seymourduncan.com/abigail/

I mean - I understand, she was probably good at her job as a Fender factory worker - showed up on time, followed directions, worked to specs - but this recent deification of Abigail Ybarra as some kind of Zen Master Pickup Winder to the Stars is way, way out in orbit around Uranus. I doubt she ever even heard any of the guitars she built pickups for, at least not till the last few years. If there's any "genius" at all at play here, it's in the marketing department's breathtaking gall in taking advantage of the magical thinking still epidemic among so-called "educated" consumers....

"Heh, heh, heh - and on the 'Custom Shop' guitars - you know, the ones with the finished frets - we'll charge another $1,200 for a set of 'Genuine Abbys!' Ha Ha, Ha...heh. These frickin' rubes'll buy anything!"

So if you're a young kid in a crappy factory job, take heart - maybe in fifty years the boss will... well no, never mind. Look at the size of Duncan's factory... boy I'll bet each and every one of them get to hear the pickups they build, too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magical_thinking
 
Sub, that is a great opinion
but like all opinions it is full of shit
Abby's handiwork has been sought out by artist for a long time, that is why she is considered the queen of tone in the upper circles
She would never have been singled out, and sought till they figured out it was her pickups they were looking for if she did not have some touch.
Weather that touch is intended or is just in the way she naturally times her windings is the debate, not weather she can hit that tone sought after consistently.
It is like welding, I do it because of a lot of practice and have to make a few passes on scrap before I start if working that day as a welder (specialty trade in the IBEW) however I know guys who can not have welded in months pick up a stinger and make a perfect pass each time, Muscle memory is a huge part of it.
Nothing creepy, just natural Mojo. I do believe in it.
 
I think it's a bunch of hype. This society is full of hype.
I'm sure she is very good at her job, but there are lots of people who know how to wind pickups (and do it well).
With enough time and repetition, a monkey could probably be taught to do it.
Does she even play guitar?
 
I don't see the relevance of her playing guitar. Have you ever played pickups she made? Those are the opinions that would actually have some merit. I have a set she wound and I love them. I'm not saying that what she does can't be done by anyone else but she's the one doing it and has been forever. I'm willing to bet her not playing guitar has probably helped her have consistent results. She doesn't have preconceived notions that she knows what tone is. She winds the coils the way she knows they need to be wound nothing more nothing less. That video had two of the most storied winders ever and I find it hilarious that some forumites want to pick them apart. The woman has been winding pickups longer than most of us have been wiping our asses.
 
yea I have to admit it was kinda creepy watching him dance, but then, hey if you have the money he has, then you can dance creepy all you want. If someone complains, have Olaf show them out.
Tank20Abbott_300_display_image.jpg
 
If I was to send you a sound sample, could you tell the difference between one she has wound and another type wound by someone else?  No.

And that's all the answer I need when choosing to spend the extra $$$.
 
pabloman said:
I don't see the relevance of her playing guitar. Have you ever played pickups she made? Those are the opinions that would actually have some merit. I have a set she wound and I love them. I'm not saying that what she does can't be done by anyone else but she's the one doing it and has been forever. I'm willing to bet her not playing guitar has probably helped her have consistent results. She doesn't have preconceived notions that she knows what tone is. She winds the coils the way she knows they need to be wound nothing more nothing less. That video had two of the most storied winders ever and I find it hilarious that some forumites want to pick them apart. The woman has been winding pickups longer than most of us have been wiping our asses.
Click to expand...

Pickup winding is not Rocket Science or Nuclear Physics. And the "relevance" is that I like my guitars and components to be made by people who actually play the instrument.  I like all products I buy to be made by people who know how to use that product.

I have no idea whether or not I've played the pickups she's made, but that is irrelevant based upon my previous statements.
And just how the hell would "not playing guitar" help her have consistent results??  'Talk about irrelevant.
 
Elfro Abby pickups are available at the same price others are. As a matter of fact there are some that are $100 less than boutique pups. You're statement about being able to tell hers by listening to a clip is just silly. Can you tell anyone's pickups just by hearing a clip? No. C'Mon dude if you're going to chime in say something with substance.
 
Street.......did you read my post? I stated how the hell I thought her not playing would benefit her. So let's clear this up, on one hand you are saying that a monkey can wind great pickups, its not rocket science. Yet on the other hand you are saying you prefer your guitar components to be built by musicians. Why? If a monkey can do it and its only about muscle memory. Do you really think all the winders at DiMARZIO and Duncan play? Do you think the factory workers making the rest of the guitar components are players?  Thanks for being so entertaining street. Now go back to making serious posts.
 
pabloman said:
Street.......did you read my post? I stated how the hell I thought her not playing would benefit her. So let's clear this up, on one hand you are saying that a monkey can wind great pickups, its not rocket science. Yet on the other hand you are saying you prefer your guitar components to be built by musicians. Why? If a monkey can do it and its only about muscle memory. Do you really think all the winders at DiMARZIO and Duncan play? Do you think the factory workers making the rest of the guitar components are players?  Thanks for being so entertaining street. Now go back to making serious posts.
Click to expand...


I never said that I prefer my pickups to be wound by monkeys. I simply pointed out that it's not that technical, and that I seriously doubt that her pickups are any better than any others that are wound by anyone with experience (remember I used the words "time" and "repetition").

I do prefer my pickups and all guitar components to be designed and manufactured by people who actually play guitar. That is a fact. I am well aware that things don't always turn out that way.

And you never did explain (at least not in any scientific way) how not playing guitar can make pickup winding more consistent. As if being a guitar player is going to hinder one's ability to wind consistent pickups.

I stated my opinion and stated facts. You seem to be trying to turn this into a battle of wits or something.

I still maintain that it's a bunch hype. She's a good pickup winder, and so are a hundred other people. Whoop-dee-doo.
 
She's a good pickup winder, and so are a hundred other people.
Click to expand...

I'd say it's closer to a hundred other companies by now. Back in the sixties people said that every once in a while you could get an old guitar that was pretty special - which is why Hendrix bought "new" '68 and '69 CBS Strats four at a time, though he often couldn't tell which was which. Santana's first album two albums - a 1968 reissue Les Paul. But MOST of the old guitars were trashed, particularly Fenders, and particularly their microphonic, unreliable and inconsistent pickups.  Bill Lawrence started out re-winding them in Dan Armstrong's shop, where his assistants were Kent Armstrong and Larry DiMarzio. DiMarzio was actually the first person to market total replacements - needed because so many of the old ones had died, and "wax potting" was a secret, known only to a few repairmen. And in 1976 Gibson sued Ibanez, and many Japanese companies started making original guitars. The marketing meme that "the old ones were better" has proven to be fantastically successful financially for the people who pushed it hard, and even though there were relatively few vintage 50's guitars available in the early 80's, by the end of that decade many dealers had racks full of them. One might inquire as to what happened to all the old jigs and patterns "abandoned" by Ibanez, Burny, Tokai, Aria... And by now the roof's blown off. There are at least five books/courses on how to wind your own pickups, two on how to build a winder out of sewing machines, record turntables or from scratch, innumerable YouTube videos and websites explaining one homebuilt winder or another and at least one complete readymade machine, the Schatten. Even this one little tiny website has it's own winder, Troubled Tele.... and subversive magnet-swappers too. TDPRI's got about eight? Nine? And it's not just that wire, bobbin fiber, magnets, magnet-izers, wax-potting gluepots that are available, down to the most exact vintage detail if that's what you want, it's that ALL the info on what makes pickups do what they do is out there. I'm personally glad that Bill Lawrence, Lace, Harmonic Design (and many others) have moved on to making wider-spectrum pickups, because I'd rather have the choice of what frequencies to cut than having old-fashioned pickups that dictate it to you, but even if you like the old-fashioned tone there are dozens of people (and a boatload of corps who each employ dozens of pips) who can get it to you with consistency, something never ever ever* said about the early Fenders OR Gibsons (until 1998, when people realized some dumbass would pay 1,000's of dollars for even a late 70's strat!, much less an old one that just didn't happen to work). Nowadays of course, an old Fender with original solder that doesn't WORK is worth far more than a repaired one (not that anyone would ever, ahem, fake an old solder joint with a bit of heated-on dirt... not just to make an extra $10,000. Why you could GO TO HELL for that!)

*(Several people have played SRV's original beat-to-crap Strat and said that the pickups WERE "special"; Steve Morse recorded over the years with Duane Allman's REAL Les Paul, the tobacco sunburst one that had the pickups Duane took out of the goldtop. Morse (who actually knows some shit) said that those pickups were indeed "special." WHICH MEANS THAT ALL THE OTHER ONES WEREN'T.

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Pickup_building/i-1465.html
http://www.skguitar.com/SKGS/sk/winder2.htm

Disambiguation A* - In 1965, when Eric Clapton recorded the Beano album with John Mayall, he was playing a five-year old guitar. When he recorded with Cream, he was playing an SG and a 335 between four and six years old. When Peter Green was playing with Fleetwood Mac, his guitar was 8 years old. Hendrix, Santana, Garcia and many others usually used new guitars. Duane Allman probably takes the prize, he used Les Pauls that were ten to twelve years old. Jimmy Page's Les Paul was so dicked with both prior to and during his ownership, can you call it "authentic?" "Authentically" dicked-with, mebbe.

Disambiguation B* - When you say you want a round tone, but not muddy (not ever that), and a bright tone with good chimes but NO "ice-pick" nads forbid, when you want a sound that growls, but with clarity, and screams (but so tenderly) - what you're really asking for is a straight, ordinary, usual, average sound, right up the middle-of-the-road. Just like what everybody else sounds like. Really. May your howls whisper and your whispers howl on forever....

Disambiguation (meaning): clarification, elucidation, illumination - an interpretation that removes obstacles to understanding ->

chainsawbill_small.gif

 
Pablo, You just have to step back and let it go. You now see why we are destroying the planet under ourselves to the detriment of our future. Ignorance and denial is stronger than the desire to learn.
Most the guys denying her are also unable to identify a tone by just listening to it, which is an easy thing to learn.
Fender found out a long time ago that people sought out the pickups she was winding, If that is not proof enough or her abilities, then why would Mr Duncan, a person who is considered the person with the most research into what makes tone in a pickup, honoring her like this. Going so far as to winding a pickup with her for his private collection.
If she had no mojo in those fingers , Fender would have replaced her with a robot 30 years ago.
 
Gentlemen,

I am very interested in this thread and would like to know more.  I have some questions:

1 - How did the public find out about her work?  was it that her initials were on pickups that they happened to like?
2 - Pabloman - how long have you had a set by her and what do you compare them to?  I assume they are strat pickups - correct?

and finally

3 - For how long have you been able to get her pickups?  Does fender offer them or can I order directly from her somehow?

 
She does all sorts. The set I had were some plain Jane custom shop 69's. They were about $140. But she winds different ones too. 
 
Just an observation but...as someone pointed out earlier things in the 50 through early 70s had pretty poor QC and alot of the technology was new and just getting refined. Stories of buying mutiple guitars to find one that sounds good are all over the net. What if most of the pick-up winders on the line actually sucked at their job and just mindlessly wound. I think If I made a pick-up it would probably sound like crap. Now what if she just excelled at her job while everyone else sucked. So if her pickups were just status quo they would still stand out and eventually garner a name for herself. So these wouldn't be the best of the best, just good. I don't think you can improve upon perfection. I think 2 compentant winders would get the same results and would not be any different form each other. Now me and a compentant winder that is a different story.

Just my thoughts
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top