Babicz Z-Series Tele Bridge.........

[BigSteve22]

So, I've been looking at this bridge:

It's the Babicz Z-Series Tele Bridge. According to the Babicz FAQ, and from an examination of the drawerings, it differs from the "Original" series in that it has a steel base plate, (instead of aluminum), only the saddle height adjusters lock, (instead of the intonation locking as well), the intonation screws are centered on the saddles, (instead of offset), it is dedicate as a four screw vintage mount, (instead of both vintage and American standard 3 screw), and is string through body only, (instead of also having an accommodation for passing the strings through the rear of the base plate).

Now, I prefer the centered intonations screws for a straight pull on the string, (may not really make a difference, but that's just my take on it), and I don't really care if the intonation locks or not. I think the androgynous mounting of the "Original" series is just silly looking, I mean who really wants extra, unused holes in a bridge they're paying $140 for? And, as I intend to use string through mounting, the extra string holes in the rear of the plate are just that: More extra holes.  And a BIG plus, the Babicz name is etched in a nice small font, instead of the normal,

Babicz Billboard,​

sized font! Aside from the aforementioned features, my main reasons for considering this bridge are the saddle design, and the fact that it just plain looks cool! And let's face it, at $77.95, it's a bargain!

The reason for posting is this: I have no experience with Telecasters. I've read elsewhere that part of the "tone formula" of a Tele is the bridge mounting plate. One review said that the steel plate is essential to getting that "tele tone". Another said that the steel plate has a negative effect, muddying the tone, and highly recommends a non-magnetic material. As is common in any subjective discussion, especially regarding "TONE", my reaction is a solid, WTF???

I have a set of Bill Lawrence NF Tele pickups on order. I understand that these are in no way traditional Tele pups, and I don't expect them to sound like traditional pups. Any insights into the combination of a steel plate and a Bill Lawrence NF bridge pup, or on the effect of a steel vs. non-magnetic plate on tone in general?

 

[vetteman]

I used a set of the Babicz saddles on my last tele build (on a vintage strat hardtail bridge plate) and they work great.  Had originally been purchased for a strat vintage tremolo on another guitar (a strat) and I could not get them to work well in that application.  But after I gave up on them and stored them for a couple years, they worked great on the tele.  Go figure!  The design is awesome for setting action height!

 

[BigSteve22]

I used a set of the Babicz saddles on my last tele build (on a vintage strat hardtail bridge plate) and they work great.  Had originally been purchased for a strat vintage tremolo on another guitar (a strat) and I could not get them to work well in that application.  But after I gave up on them and stored them for a couple years, they worked great on the tele.  Go figure!  The design is awesome for setting action height!

Yeah, I've been looking at that saddle design for a while, and just couldn't get past the billboard etching on their parts! Now It's just a question of the steel base plate vs. SS or brass. Did your build have a steel plate?

 

[amigarobbo]

I fitted one onto a Gibson Thunderbird bass, I liked it, possible slight improvement in sustain, but I'm prepared to put that down to suggestion, but it was a nice chunky bridge much more adjustable than the Gibson 3 post 'Oil Rig' bridge.

Not a problem with a bass, well, not my playing anyway, but because the strings are below the level of the bridge you can't palm mute, well, you sorta can, but not as well. That is what put me off putting a Babitz on my Epiphone SG. Your milage etc. etc.


That and the price, for a cheapish guitar anyway.

 

[amigarobbo]

The reason for posting is this: I have no experience with Telecasters. I've read elsewhere that part of the "tone formula" of a Tele is the bridge mounting plate. One review said that the steel plate is essential to getting that "tele tone". Another said that the steel plate has a negative effect, muddying the tone, and highly recommends a non-magnetic material. As is common in any subjective discussion, especially regarding "TONE", my reaction is a solid, WTF???

I have a set of Bill Lawrence NF Tele pickups on order. I understand that these are in no way traditional Tele pups, and I don't expect them to sound like traditional pups. Any insights into the combination of a steel plate and a Bill Lawrence NF bridge pup, or on the effect of a steel vs. non-magnetic plate on tone in general?

Stainless Steel is non-magnetic.

I dunno to be honest, I like the Gotoh titanium saddled one I've got, but when I dig in to the strings I want the 'Trotski' sound.

I don't even know what type of metal the plate is made of,  :icon_scratch:

 

[Cagey]

I have a set of Bill Lawrence NF Tele pickups on order. I understand that these are in no way traditional Tele pups, and I don't expect them to sound like traditional pups. Any insights into the combination of a steel plate and a Bill Lawrence NF bridge pup, or on the effect of a steel vs. non-magnetic plate on tone in general? 

I installed a set of Bill Lawrence Microcoil pickups in a Gotoh version of a traditional Tele bridge, and they sound great. It was a new build, though. Nothing to compare to. And even if these would have been replacement pickups, both sets would have been under the alleged influence of the same bridge plate. So, what does the plate do? Dunno. I'm guessing probably nothing. Many electric guitar "facts" that don't make sense are just urban legend, regardless of how widespread their acceptance is.

Theoretically, having the pickup installed in a steel plate like that sets up eddy currents in the plate that affect the magnetic field of the pickup and change its sound. Magnetic fields, ferrous metals and eddy currents are certainly all real things. Transformers, pickups, motors, and other widgetry wouldn't work without them. But, are they an actor in this situation? You'd have to install the pickup in the traditional manner using one of those mounting plate/bridge assemblies, check its behavior, then replace that assembly with a different bridge that doesn't have the metal pickup mounting plate, and check the pickup's behavior again. I've never seen it done.

Ever heard of “medical student’s disease”? It's a phenomena where med students begin to notice symptoms of something they're studying in their own body, and become convinced they're suffering from [whatever]. It's purely psychological, of course. The power of suggestion, and all that. I suspect most professions have variations of the same thing. You're learning esoteric facts about things that aren't widely known, and you start to see evidence of those things all over the place. I can easily imagine some young rock 'n' roller attending Electric Mysteries 101 and suddenly having an epiphany about Telecasters and why they sound the way they do. Eddy Currents! What else could it be? It's the main diffference, besides the sound, between Teles and all other guitars. So, our enlightened young genius relates his newfound understanding to some of his less-educated freinds who repeat this fresh wisdom all over the place and Poof! A "fact" is born. Never mind that typical Tele bridge pickups are different than most other pickups.

The power of suggestion. It's a thing.​

 

[BigSteve22]

I fitted one onto a Gibson Thunderbird bass, I liked it, possible slight improvement in sustain, but I'm prepared to put that down to suggestion, but it was a nice chunky bridge much more adjustable than the Gibson 3 post 'Oil Rig' bridge.

Not a problem with a bass, well, not my playing anyway, but because the strings are below the level of the bridge you can't palm mute, well, you sorta can, but not as well. That is what put me off putting a Babitz on my Epiphone SG. Your milage etc. etc.

That and the price, for a cheapish guitar anyway.

Stainless Steel is non-magnetic.

I dunno to be honest, I like the Gotoh titanium saddled one I've got, but when I dig in to the strings I want the 'Trotski' sound.

I don't even know what type of metal the plate is made of,  :icon_scratch:

Thanks for info. Just one quick point though: Not all Stainless is "non-magnetic". It all depends on the crystalline structure that forms as it cools. The structure is determined by the additives used, such as chromium, molybdenum, carbon, nickle..... In the non-magnetic forms, the iron crystallizes and remains in the form of austenite, which is why common stainless is often referred to as ‘austenitic’. (I learned this while researching another project, certainly more than I wanted or needed to learn about the subject! Just more esoteric knowledge floating around in my head.....)

I installed a set of Bill Lawrence Microcoil pickups in a Gotoh version of a traditional Tele bridge, and they sound great. It was a new build, though. Nothing to compare to. And even if these would have been replacement pickups, both sets would have been under the alleged influence of the same bridge plate. So, what does the plate do? Dunno. I'm guessing probably nothing......

That's exactly what I would have guessed: Nothing! At least nothing my ears could discern. Thanks Kevin.

 

[mayfly]

As a multi-guitar telecaster authority, I can tell you that the plate material probably has nothing to do with the sound of the guitar.  What's more likely to change the tone is the material the bridge saddles are made from.  I'm partial to brass for that 'spanky' percussive sound.  However, steel ones sound just fine as well.  Different, but just fine.

As far as brands go, I've found that good old Gotoh bridges/saddles sound as good as the expensive boutique stuff. 

In the final analysis, even though I have never tried that bridge, I wager it's going to sound pretty good.  If you like it, have at it!

 

[BigSteve22]

As a multi-guitar telecaster authority, I can tell you that the plate material probably has nothing to do with the sound of the guitar.  What's more likely to change the tone is the material the bridge saddles are made from.  I'm partial to brass for that 'spanky' percussive sound.  However, steel ones sound just fine as well.  Different, but just fine.

As far as brands go, I've found that good old Gotoh bridges/saddles sound as good as the expensive boutique stuff. 

In the final analysis, even though I have never tried that bridge, I wager it's going to sound pretty good.  If you like it, have at it!

I'm hoping you're right there Brother, because I just ordered the bridge! It's only about $20USD more than the Gotoh, and it's got those cool looking saddles, without the billboard sized Babicz logo!  :icon_jokercolor: