Angled neck pocket and screws

[Last Triumph]

I bought a fully finished neck and body (carved top VIP) some years ago and am just finished it off now - life got in the way.

One thing I've always struggled with is the relationship between the neck, pocket, screws and back plate.

Due to it having an angled neck pocket, naturally the surface of the rear of the neck is not parallel to the rear of the body.

I had a member on here (Cagey? IIRC) set up the neck for me and install machine screw inserts so everything was ready to assemble. He did a sterling job and the neck plays like wet ice on ice.

It's too long ago for me to remember set up details, but what I am finding is that the screws do not enter the body at right angles to the body, but right angles to the neck. Due to the angled neck pocket, this results in the screw heads not siting flat against the neck plate.

Is this how it's supposed to be, or should the machine screw neck inserts have been inserted at the correct angle so the screws enter the rear of the body at right angles?

Or, when an angled neck pocket is ordered from Warmoth, do they automatically drill the holes through the body at an angle so they come through the neck pocket and into the neck at 90 degrees on the inside?

I'm kind of lost as to what should be the correct way to deal with the screw angles - perp to the rear of the body, or perp to the rear of the neck?

Mine are perp to the rear of the neck, hence enter the rear of the body at an angle.

I'm clearly not the first person every to have an angled neck pocket, everything was ordered fully finished and drilled, so I guess I'm asking is this correct and if so, how do you deal with angled screw heads in the neck plate?

Or if this is wrong, how did I (they?) get it wrong and what, if anything can be done about it?

Logic tells me that if the body had been drilled perp to the rear of the body, I'd have never got the screws to line up with the holes in the neck, so the orientation must have matched between body and neck.

Any thoughts and guidance please?

Hopefully this diagram explains what I'm going on about...

What is correct?

The paler shaded grey version is what I have which results in my problem of the screw heads not sitting fluch in the neck plate which strikes me as an odd way to finish a guitar.

 

[Fat Pete]

While I suppose you theoretically could have the screws going into the neck at an odd angle - if it wasn't already drilled - the way you have it is the normal way.

The combination of angled pocket and contoured heel obviously increases the effect. This one of mine is like that:

You can see it, but I'd suggest worrying about more important stuff; like whether the copper in your cable is 100% or only 99.9% oxygen free.

 

[Last Triumph]

Dang - I hadn't considered the copper purity <wrings hands>

As long as I don't have an issue and what I have is 'normal' for my set up, then we're all good.

 

[Cagey]

Your memory is correct - I'm the one who finalized your neck. I remember it because it was such a fantastic piece, it made me giggle to myself when i took it out of the box. Just an absolutely gorgeous piece of work.

Anyway, the neck and body screw holes are perpendicular to the neck and body because otherwise they'd have to make necks peculiar to the bodies they mate with, and vice-versa. Since Warmoth's necks and bodies are mostly designed to be mixed/matched and/or used as replacement parts for existing bodies/necks going back thousands of years, some areas of commonality have to be maintained. Neck mounting is one of them. But, because of that orientation, when you modify an ancient design to have a contoured body heel, some of the screw heads are going to appear slightly angled off the plane. Fortunately, the screw heads and neck plate holes are countersunk together, so a bit of angle doesn't adversely affect contact area or compression force.

As you can see from Pete's picture, if you didn't know about it, you'd probably never see it. But of course...

 

[Ace Flibble]

Or, when an angled neck pocket is ordered from Warmoth, do they automatically drill the holes through the body at an angle so they come through the neck pocket and into the neck at 90 degrees on the inside?

They drill both completely straight. So if you buy a body with a bridge which they angle the neck pocket for, yes, the holes in the body and the neck heel won't quite line up. It's a small angle so you'll get the bolts in most of the way before you feel them hit up against the sides of the holes in the neck.

The solution I've found is to simply cut the bolts short. Take a hacksaw to them and knock off the top half centimetre or so and they'll fit in flush. If you're also getting a contoured heel then you'll need to cut a little more off. Buying shorter bolts (like the two included in a set for use with the contoured heel; buy two sets so you have four short bolts in total) also works. The neck and body connection is no less stable as far as I can see or feel after years of use.


(That said, this kind of faffing about is the #1 reason I prefer to order Warmoth bodies with no bridge specified, so I drill them & shim the neck myself. I've found most of them don't need the angled pocket or a shim, anyway.)

 

[Last Triumph]

Your memory is correct - I'm the one who finalized your neck. I remember it because it was such a fantastic piece, it made me giggle to myself when i took it out of the box. Just an absolutely gorgeous piece of work.

Anyway, the neck and body screw holes are perpendicular to the neck and body because otherwise they'd have to make necks peculiar to the bodies they mate with, and vice-versa. Since Warmoth's necks and bodies are mostly designed to be mixed/matched and/or used as replacement parts for existing bodies/necks going back thousands of years, some areas of commonality have to be maintained. Neck mounting is one of them. But, because of that orientation, when you modify an ancient design to have a contoured body heel, some of the screw heads are going to appear slightly angled off the plane. Fortunately, the screw heads and neck plate holes are countersunk together, so a bit of angle doesn't adversely affect contact area or compression force.

As you can see from Pete's picture, if you didn't know about it, you'd probably never see it. But of course...

Hey buddy - good of you to check in. I've had another look at it today and 75% of the problem is caused by the contoured heel rather than the angled neck pocket- the two together just mean that there is a significant angle between the head of the screw and the neck plate.

As aesthetic considerations are right at the top of my fussy list, I think I'll make a new neck plate, a little thicker than stock so I can countersink the holes a little deeper and at the correct angle.

I'll finish it one day!

So far...

 

[Logrinn]

Wow!
That is a stunning piece of guitar!

 

[TBurst Std]

Somethings wrong with your guitar.  It's made backward

 

[Last Triumph]

Somethings wrong with your guitar.  It's made backward

I did wonder why my scales sounded weird.

Joking aside, I haven't had the heart to tell DangerousR6 that when he made my custom engraved trussrod cover, he made it right handed, hence the letters are upside down.

 

[Ace Flibble]

Good work on the control positioning, that's much nicer than the standard.

 

[T89Rex]

Holy crap! I'm not normally a big fan of figured maple tops but that one looks like you could swim in it. Outstanding.