Single Coil Distortion

[Wizard of Wailing]

    I only have one guitar with single coils, and I have a hard time getting a solid distortion sound out of it. It sounds overdriven, but not distorted enough. Does anyone have any good distortion or fuzz pedal recommendations for single coils?

 

[line6man]

My experience with fuzz is that it really doesn't matter what kind of signal you start with. It all ends up with a similar-sounding waveform. In any case, there are two types of fuzz circuits. Older designs used the impedance of the pickup coils as a part of the circuit. Others, however, don't care about input impedances, so you can use whatever pickups you want.

It sounds like your issue has more to do with your rig than your choice of pickups, though. Have you tried the guitar through different amps and effects?

 

[Cagey]

    I only have one guitar with single coils, and I have a hard time getting a solid distortion sound out of it. It sounds overdriven, but not distorted enough. Does anyone have any good distortion or fuzz pedal recommendations for single coils?

All fuzz and most distortion pedals sound fake, so anybody can tell you're cheating from a mile away. What Line6man says is true. If what you really want is fuzz, the cheapest, dirtiest part you can buy is probably going to be fine, as they all sound like regurgitating goats who've been possessed by de debbil. If you want the distorted sound of an overdriven amp, the best thing you can do is simply boost the guitar's signal with either a hotter pickup like Seymour Duncan's Hot Rails or a power booster like the LPB-1. As inexpensive as those solutions seem, don't discount them. They sound real, which is worth a lot.

Past that, you can get the best of both worlds with one of the 7,319 variations of the Tube Screamer. It's far and away the most popular device of its kind, but the good ones are pricey and you really need to hear one with your guitar and your amp to know if it's going to work for you.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

Come on, a Big Muff sounds nothing like a Fuzz Face.

Single coil distortion can of course sound absolutely fine, as evidenced by the Floyd albums for a start. Most of those tones are a Fuzz Face, a Big Muff, a RAT, a HM-2, a BK Butler Tube Driver... distortion pedals, basically. He's never used amp distortion in his life as far as I can tell.

 

[Cagey]

Come on, a Big Muff sounds nothing like a Fuzz Face.

Single coil distortion can of course sound absolutely fine, as evidenced by the Floyd albums for a start. Most of those tones are a Fuzz Face, a Big Muff, a RAT, a HM-2, a BK Butler Tube Driver... distortion pedals, basically. He's never used amp distortion in his life as far as I can tell.

You're right; a Big Muff sounds nothing like a Fuzz Face. It's also true that a wah pedal sounds nothing like an echoplex, and a flanger sounds nothing like a compressor. So, I'm not sure of the point you're trying to make.

I'm sure Mr. Waters (or Gilmore or Smith or whoever) used sfx here and there, but I don't think they relied on overdrive or distortion pedals to get that singing sustain that was so characteristic of many of their solos. That was overdriven amplifiers at high volume. Happiest day of my life was when I got my first Marshall after getting my first house. Finally! Real distortion! Prior to that, it was as you say - Big Muffs, Tube Screamers, Rats, etc. - all in an effort to sound like a big-ass horse-whipped amp. Get the real thing, and it doesn't need any help. I haven't even owned a distortion or overdrive pedal in probably 20 years now. Don't need 'em. Although, to be fair, I've used overdrive effects in some modellers here and there because you can't always play at ear-bleeding levels.

 

[line6man]

Come on, a Big Muff sounds nothing like a Fuzz Face.

Single coil distortion can of course sound absolutely fine, as evidenced by the Floyd albums for a start. Most of those tones are a Fuzz Face, a Big Muff, a RAT, a HM-2, a BK Butler Tube Driver... distortion pedals, basically. He's never used amp distortion in his life as far as I can tell.

I'm not sure what you're trying to argue, either. We're talking about different input waveforms into one circuit, not identical input waveforms into different circuits.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

I was just making the point that if all fuzzes "sound like regurgitating goats who've been possessed by de debbil" then surely they'd all sound the same. But FF and BM are both fuzz circuits and they don't sound the same. Sorry if that was misunderstood.

And no, Gilmour wasn't using overdriven amps. Just clean amps, but yes, really really loud. His distortion comes from pedals. Technically the Tube Driver, one of the lesser-used pedals, is "real" distortion, as it's basically a tube amp in a pedal. But the rest are just transistors. "The" Gilmour singing sustain sound is a Big Muff into a clean tube amp turned up to ear-splitting volume. But turn the Muff off and it goes back to being crystal clean.

I just think writing off distortion pedals is a bit strong when so many classic sounds have been produced using them.

As for single coils, the best thing to do is realise that it will never sound like a humbucker into distortion. But it's still a nice sound, so either get some humbuckers if that's what you're after, or an EQ pedal to go with your distortion where you can tune it a bit, or just a pedal with a good EQ on it. I used to use the much-maligned Metal Zone for years. Once you learn how to dial it in there's some great sounds for single coil distortion in there. Just needs practice to get rid of the fizz everyone rightly despises.

 

[fdesalvo]

I love the tone of my bridge bucker split with med to high gain.  I run the following pedals.  For fat single coil tones with clarity and sustain, I like to run the G2D into the Elements or the Elements into the JHS for a more pissed off tele type sound - modern country (less gainy, but very clear and crushing).  This is not a metal setup with a single coil, btw.  VERY good for hard rock.  You could pull off 80 metal if you wanted to.

 

[LushTone]

I like the overdriven sound of my Emg ha (an sa in humbucker size) straight through my amp with the gain up. Emgs sound nice with high gain because they retain good clarity (less mudd).

 

[Wizard of Wailing]

    A Twin Reverb is what I use, so I had to get a pedal. I ended up getting the divisive Metal Zone. This guitar is the only single coil I have out of 5 so I really didn't want to put a humbucker in it, just to have some variety.  The Metal Zone does sound fake, but it's a good kind of fake if you find the right settings. I'm able to get a Metallica "...And Justice For All" sound out of it. My other pedals allow me to get a decent overdrive sound, but the Metal Zone puts it over the top. In the bridge there's a Dimarzio Area 67, which is 60 cycle hum free, so I have no complaints.

 

[makemyfunkthepfunk]

Come on, a Big Muff sounds nothing like a Fuzz Face.


I'm sure Mr. Waters (or Gilmore or Smith or whoever) used sfx here and there, but I don't think they relied on overdrive or distortion pedals to get that singing sustain that was so characteristic of many of their solos. That was overdriven amplifiers at high volume. Happiest day of my life was when I got my first Marshall after getting my first house. Finally! Real distortion! Prior to that, it was as you say - Big Muffs, Tube Screamers, Rats, etc. - all in an effort to sound like a big-ass horse-whipped amp. Get the real thing, and it doesn't need any help. I haven't even owned a distortion or overdrive pedal in probably 20 years now. Don't need 'em. Although, to be fair, I've used overdrive effects in some modellers here and there because you can't always play at ear-bleeding levels.

Actually Dave Gilmour did not use overdriven amps, he used a Hiwatt or a Fender twin with a fuzz pedal.  He didnt use his amp for distortion.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

Yeah I already said that! ccasion14:

 

[makemyfunkthepfunk]

i wasnt meaning to say that you were the one who said it, the damn thing was telling me that last year was not 2012 when i tried to post what i was saying and things got all messed up with my post.  my comment was directed at cagey and i hadnt read your comment.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

No worries buddy. :guitarplayer2:

 

[mullyman]

A bit more info is needed, specifically, what amp are you using? I don't know anything about other than what I saw in this thread, so don't take this personally if I'm mistaken. It's easy for us 40+ year old guys to sit here and tell you all day long that you should have a Marshall, Mesa, Soldano etc... Truth of the matter is this, a lot of young people don't have the funds to run out and buy a really nice tube amp. Hell, a lot of people our age don't have the funds for it, and there's absolutely nothing wrong or embarrassing about that. Point being, if a pedal is what can afford then we shouldn't be so quick to point towards amps that cost hundreds and even thousands of dollars. So, my suggestion for a pedal would be this, check out amp modeling stuff like Line6. In my opinion, modeling pretty much negates pickups. I have a line6 amp here and I get pretty much the same sounds no matter which guitar I use.
MULLY

 

[Cagey]

Modern modelling solutions can be magical. It's to the point where you almost have to be a masochist to own a tube amp. Not that tube amps sound bad or anything - far from it - but they can be a real pain in the shorts and you don't need to go there any more. The state of the art has negated them.

 

[mullyman]

Modern modelling solutions can be magical. It's to the point where you almost have to be a masochist to own a tube amp. Not that tube amps sound bad or anything - far from it - but they can be a real pain in the shorts and you don't need to go there any more. The state of the art has negated them.

I don't know, man. I usually agree with pretty much everything you post but I've yet to find a modeler that sounds as good as a tube amp at high volume.....at least on my budget. I think they sound great in a room setting at lower volume. Crank it up though and it just doesn't have the warmth/personality of a tube amp. What I also dislike about the modelers is that anyone that picks up my guitar can sound exactly like me, tone wise.
MULLY
agree with the PIA though

 

[Wizard of Wailing]

    I use a Fender Twin Reverb.

 

[Cagey]

Modern modelling solutions can be magical. It's to the point where you almost have to be a masochist to own a tube amp. Not that tube amps sound bad or anything - far from it - but they can be a real pain in the shorts and you don't need to go there any more. The state of the art has negated them.

I don't know, man. I usually agree with pretty much everything you post but I've yet to find a modeler that sounds as good as a tube amp at high volume.....at least on my budget. I think they sound great in a room setting at lower volume. Crank it up though and it just doesn't have the warmth/personality of a tube amp. What I also dislike about the modelers is that anyone that picks up my guitar can sound exactly like me, tone wise.
MULLY
agree with the PIA though

"on my budget" may be the operative phrase there. You haven't had fun until you've plugged into an Axe Fx II or a Kemper profiler. Both those units are just magical; no other word to describe them. They're no flash in the pan; they're the real deal. Problem is, you need a good transparent amp, a good floor controller and a good FRFR (full-range, flat response) speaker or monitor. By the time you're ready to go, you're down about $3.700 or so.

But, that's what a good tube amp costs these days, and most of those are one-trick ponies with built-in deficiencies that never go away. Worse yet, they weigh a million pounds and take up a lotta space. Get an AxeFx or a Kemper and you can switch between a Fender Twin, a JCM 800, a Dumble, a Matchless, a Mark V, etc. connected to any cabinet you can imagine using sfx that you could only afford in your dreams. Then, they never deteriorate - they always sound perfect. There are no tubes or capacitor or anything else to wear out. You don't necessarily even need a cabinet - you plug into the FOH system and it's perfect. So, your load-out drops to almost nothing. You're down to carrying your guitar and a 2 to 4 space rack that might weigh 20 lbs. all up.

A lotta guys don't believe it. Then they see/hear it and become believers. These aren't Line 6 Pods, Digitech whatchamacallits or Behringer V-Amps. They make die-hards sell off boat loads of traditional amps/bottoms. I know myself the myriad catalogs I get aren't interesting any more. Nothing to lust over. Between Warmoth guitars and the Axe Fx, nobody offers a better instrument, amp or effect.

As far as "anybody" sounding like you, that risk has always been there and it's not an equipment problem.

 

[mullyman]

Modern modelling solutions can be magical. It's to the point where you almost have to be a masochist to own a tube amp. Not that tube amps sound bad or anything - far from it - but they can be a real pain in the shorts and you don't need to go there any more. The state of the art has negated them.

I don't know, man. I usually agree with pretty much everything you post but I've yet to find a modeler that sounds as good as a tube amp at high volume.....at least on my budget. I think they sound great in a room setting at lower volume. Crank it up though and it just doesn't have the warmth/personality of a tube amp. What I also dislike about the modelers is that anyone that picks up my guitar can sound exactly like me, tone wise.
MULLY
agree with the PIA though

"on my budget" may be the operative phrase there. You haven't had fun until you've plugged into an Axe Fx II or a Kemper profiler. Both those units are just magical; no other word to describe them. They're no flash in the pan; they're the real deal. Problem is, you need a good transparent amp, a good floor controller and a good FRFR (full-range, flat response) speaker or monitor. By the time you're ready to go, you're down about $3.700 or so.

But, that's what a good tube amp costs these days, and most of those are one-trick ponies with built-in deficiencies that never go away. Worse yet, they weigh a million pounds and take up a lotta space. Get an AxeFx or a Kemper and you can switch between a Fender Twin, a JCM 800, a Dumble, a Matchless, a Mark V, etc. connected to any cabinet you can imagine using sfx that you could only afford in your dreams. Then, they never deteriorate - they always sound perfect. There are no tubes or capacitor or anything else to wear out. You don't necessarily even need a cabinet - you plug into the FOH system and it's perfect. So, your load-out drops to almost nothing. You're down to carrying your guitar and a 2 to 4 space rack that might weigh 20 lbs. all up.

A lotta guys don't believe it. Then they see/hear it and become believers. These aren't Line 6 Pods, Digitech whatchamacallits or Behringer V-Amps. They make die-hards sell off boat loads of traditional amps/bottoms. I know myself the myriad catalogs I get aren't interesting any more. Nothing to lust over. Between Warmoth guitars and the Axe Fx, nobody offers a better instrument, amp or effect.

As far as "anybody" sounding like you, that risk has always been there and it's not an equipment problem.

Fair enough, spend enough money you can get the good stuff. As for tube amps being too heavy, I smartened up last year and got rid of my 4,000lb Mesa Dual Recti and went the route of the 25w Mini-Rectifier. I'm getting too old to be lugging heavy equipment around. I have never been happier with my setup in my entire life. I have that little lunchbox amp that fits in a shoulder bag, a Mini-Rectifier 1x12 slant cabinet that weighs about 15kg, and my pedal board with 4 pedals on it. I can carry everything in at once and not feel like my back is about to snap in half. hahaha!!
MULLY
and I still get to keep my Mesa Recti tube tone......and not to mention that everything fits in the back of the car so I don't need to put the seats down or use the back seat for stuff