S-S-S (Strat) wiring but with a twist.

[Re-Pete]

Hi everyone
Hope you are well safe & healthy from these challenging times.
I'm looking at a Strat copy. It's a sentimental prospect as it's a replica of my first electric guitar.
The guitar is Strat shaped with 3 single coil pickups but it has a Jaguar bridge & tailpiece/tremolo instead of the usual Strat type & the switching is also the Jaguar 3 slider switch plate.

My question is: Can the middle pickup(RWRP) be 'tied' to the neck & bridge pickups in series, so that when I select either the neck or bridge pickup selections, they are humbucking with the middle pickup providing the second coil? But when I select the middle position switch, it is only the middle pickup.

Those slider switches are IIRC, DPDT, ON/OFF type switches. If anyone wants to try a schematic that would be fantastic, but a simple 'possible' or 'not possible' would also help.

 

[stratamania]

My initial thoughts would be with DPDT on/off switches it would not be possible, perhaps if the middle slider was on/on there may be a way to do it.

 

[Rick]

I know you can get that combo with the freeway 5b5 - 01 and I think it’s hum cancelling but you should send an email to freeway to verify.

 

[Re-Pete]

My initial thoughts would be with DPDT on/off switches it would not be possible, perhaps if the middle slider was on/on there may be a way to do it.

OK, here's where my lack of electrical knowledge comes to the fore, so pardon me if I sound stupid here but...

The switch has two rows of 3 poles, with a top throw of 4 poles and a bottom throw of 4 poles (the two centre poles being common), is that right?

Now, if the middle pickup wires were wired to both the top and bottom rows that switch would always be on, right?

It's just that the top row would incorporate a series connection to the other two pickups and the bottom row would be the middle pickup single coil only.... Which is probably a good idea as the real risk of hitting the switches with your strumming fingers and turning ALL off is very real (I did that often when I was a learner on this type of guitar)...

 

[stratamania]

My initial thoughts would be with DPDT on/off switches it would not be possible, perhaps if the middle slider was on/on there may be a way to do it.

OK, here's where my lack of electrical knowledge comes to the fore, so pardon me if I sound stupid here but...

The switch has two rows of 3 poles, with a top throw of 4 poles and a bottom throw of 4 poles (the two centre poles being common), is that right?

Now, if the middle pickup wires were wired to both the top and bottom rows that switch would always be on, right?

It's just that the top row would incorporate a series connection to the other two pickups and the bottom row would be the middle pickup single coil only.... Which is probably a good idea as the real risk of hitting the switches with your strumming fingers and turning ALL off is very real (I did that often when I was a learner on this type of guitar)...

You are along the correct lines. With 2 way DPDT there are mechanically two options one switch will be on/off and the other on/on. They will look similar but the first gives the possibility of on or off. With an on/on you have two options of what is on or how it is on. Such as a series/parallel switch or a phase switch.

Some slider switches for just switching a pickup in or out might only need a SPST...

It would be relatively easy to do with a combination of those switches so that either the bridge or the neck pickup can be in series with the middle pickup, or for all three or any combination of the three to be in parallel. Would either of those suit your needs?

Another possibility may be an on/on/on DPDT for the middle pickup for the original schema you described. Where one position of the middle selector is with the neck in series, middle alone, with the bridge in series and the positions for series would be middle alone if the relevant bridge or neck selector is off.

Let me know which of the above you may like to explore (dependent on the switches being available to fit the guitar)

For reference here is a good chart.

https://guitarelectronics.com/guitar-wiring-resources/pickup-switch-terminal-connections/

I think for the original idea you will need two 2 way double pole slide switches and one 3 way double pole slide switch.

@Rick Freeway make some good switches that give a lot of possibilities but it does not meet what is being looked for here.

 

[WindsurfMaui]

Re-Pete I wanted to check in and see how your project is coming. I had a similar idea that I was going to start a thread to explore.  Before I buy humbuckers to build a humbucker Strat I thought to try to see what tones I could get from a series wired single coil Strat.  Pos 1 - Bridge, Pos 2 - Bridge + Middle in Series, Pos 3 - Middle (or Bridge + Neck in Parallel), Pos 4 - Neck + Middle in Series, Pos 5 - Neck. I would prefer to do it with the standard Pots and switches if possible if not I would be willing to add a 10 position switch or DPDT pots if necessary which ever is easier.

This Youtube site does what I want with a single DPDT but it seems a little cumbersome that I have the standard Strat wiring when the DPDT is off and the series wiring  when the DPDT is on except there is no bridge alone when the DPDT is on.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOmxRZ6IFO8  I was hoping someone here could figure out how to do it so I can leave the DPDT on and never have to shut it off.

So if anyone has an easier wiring diagram can they please send it to me.

Re-Pete if you completed your mods how are you finding the new tones? Are they what you were looking for?

. 

 

[Verne Bunsen]

If you don’t mind tackling a Super Switch and an S-1 Switch, this is a killer schematic for series/parallel SSS courtesy of Phostenix. It is actually geared toward a Nashville Tele, but I think it does what you want pretty elegantly. I plan to re-wire my Nashville this way.

 

[WindsurfMaui]

I've read some bad reviews on the S-1 switch but it looks like a good experiment so I ordered the parts and in a couple of weeks will try to assemble it and see what happens!! Thanks for the help.

 

[stratamania]

I've read some bad reviews on the S-1 switch but it looks like a good experiment so I ordered the parts and in a couple of weeks will try to assemble it and see what happens!! Thanks for the help.

Most of what you read is about it sucks the tone or it is not traditional.  All of this is a bit daft as it is a switch that does switching.

 

[WindsurfMaui]

Sorry no what I read is that the switch malfunctions and doesn't perform properly. I hope they are wrong. But I can do the same thing with a couple of push pull pots but this diagram is much cleaner.

 

[stratamania]

Sorry no what I read is that the switch malfunctions and doesn't perform properly. I hope they are wrong. But I can do the same thing with a couple of push pull pots but this diagram is much cleaner.

The switch is probably less robust than a toggle switch for example. But they are functional and the ones I have do work.

You cannot do the same thing really with two push pulls that an S1 can do. A push pull is usually DPDT and a S1 is a 4PDT. The Fat Nash wiring above uses 3 poles of the S1. So a DPDT will not do that. A 3PDT toggle switch could be used instead.

But you might be better off just getting a Freeway 10 position blade switch.

 

[WindsurfMaui]

Thanks I will consider a 10 position switch but honestly I think I'm too dumb to run a 10 position switch like the person who never gets their car out of 3rd gear!!!  :dontknow:

 

[WindsurfMaui]

  So I have ordered the parts for the  Fat Nash Tele and they would be here in about a week. But before I assemble it I had some questions and maybe an experiment to do before I try the Fat Tele. But before I get to the other experiment since I am doing this in a Strat and not a Tele there is another Tone knob. How am I wiring it and is there anything else I can do with it?

As for the other experiment, when I look at the Fat Tele experiment I'm not really interested in the normal 5 options  but only the 5 options after the S-1 is engaged. So is there a way to wire the Strat to get just the  5 series options without using the S-1 and the Super switch or just using the super switch and a DPDT pot? That would be interesting. Thanks.

 

[stratamania]

If you just wanted the 5 positions in the down position you could do that with a superswitch alone.

 

[WindsurfMaui]

  That would be cool. Do you have a link to a diagram or a website I should check out?  If I can get the right tone maybe I won't have to get humbuckers instead of single coils.

 

[stratamania]

  That would be cool. Do you have a link to a diagram or a website I should check out?  If I can get the right tone maybe I won't have to get humbuckers instead of single coils.

No I don't.  It would be straightforward to do if you know how to wire things but it may be easier for you just to get a 10 way blade switch.

 

[mysticaxe]

If I understood the initial question properly, the middle pickup is always on.  In that case, the switching is pretty simple and you don't need a bunch of slider switches.  The middle pickup would then be wired to the center lug of the on/off switch for the bridge and neck pickups (which could be as simple as SPST).  The hot lead for the bridge and neck pickups could be wired to the other lug.  You would only need 2 slider switches in this configuration.  If you wanted the third slider, it could be an on/off for the middle pickup that ties into the other two.

The 5-way superswitch opens up a lot of possibilities.  I put one in my Musikraft HH partscaster attached to a 3PDT switch (or maybe it was a 4PDT, which was hard to come by).  Basically with the "blower" switch down, I have bridge humbucker with only the volume knob, then in the up position, the 5 way switch comes in with the following:
1. Neck Hum (don't actually use this all that often)
2. Neck Single (don't remember which coil I used)
3. Inside coils parallel
4. Inside coils series (really powerful sound that is halfway between the bridge humbucker and neck)
5. Outside coils parallel (only one I don't really use).

Took me a while to get the wiring figured out, and I think my luthier had to either flip the magnet or phase of the neck humbucker to get the series position to sound right.

 

[Cactus Jack]

If you don’t mind tackling a Super Switch and an S-1 Switch, this is a killer schematic for series/parallel SSS courtesy of Phostenix. It is actually geared toward a Nashville Tele, but I think it does what you want pretty elegantly. I plan to re-wire my Nashville this way.

Very cool diagram. If you wanted to drop this in a Strat, how would you wire up a two tone controls? I've never seen or used an S1 switch, but it looks like a cool option to avoid permanently modding your pickguard/guitar.

 

[Verne Bunsen]

Very cool diagram. If you wanted to drop this in a Strat, how would you wire up a two tone controls? I've never seen or used an S1 switch, but it looks like a cool option to avoid permanently modding your pickguard/guitar.

That is a very good question... I admit I did not consider the two tone controls when I posted that. I’ve been mulling it over and have not landed on any elegant solutions. I will keep pondering it, perhaps someone else will see something I’m missing. Apologies for the oversight!

 

[WindsurfMaui]

I want to try this wiring and I even ordered a couple of S-1 switches 3 weeks ago. The company in LA shipped them and they got lost by the Post Office we waited for a few days then asked for a trace and I don't know exactly what happened but the company sent me a refund 2 days ago. So I guess I will start again and order them from someone else and see if I can do this. I had hoped to make the first tone knob a Treble bleed, maybe a dual capacitor bleed using a TBX switch (?) and make the second tone knob a Base tone control. I'm not sure I can do all that I got the idea from the Joe Gore Tonefiend youtube page. I will try it on single coils and then on Humbuckers when I get them.