P90 wiring for no hum

The Hun

Junior Member
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The rain has cancelled this weekend's camping trip, so I had some time to post this in the hopes it will be useful for trouble-shooting an annoying 60 Hertz buzz problem.  I know there are varying opinions on guitar wiring on the web, but this is just how I do it.  I get no more hum/hiss from a P90 than I do from a humbucker, and I have a guitar with one of each that allows me to toggle between the two.

For my latest Warmoth build I drew a schematic showing the complete "signal return" (RTN) circuit.  I consider this separate from the "guitar chassis ground" (GND).  This is the key to draining unwanted noise away from the signal.

Eventually the RTN and GND circuits must be combined as they share the outer braid of a coax cable to the amplifier.  Ideally this should happen at a single point as close as possible to the signal output jack.

If this is done, then the GND can be used to form a Faraday cage by making ground loops which are a good thing...an E-Field antenna to catch that buzz and drain it away from your signal.  The GND connections include the guitar's bridge (and by extension the strings and tuners), the backs of potentiometers, switch ground tabs and pickup covers (which requires a separate drain wire from the pickup return wire.)

The RTN circuit should have no loops, as these could form a loop antenna capable of introducing noise to the signal.  A star connection is ideal.  The RTN circuit includes the pickup signal return wires to the magnet coils, the volume knob return, the tone knob/capacitor circuit return and the single connection point to the chassis ground at the output jack.

Thankfully, guitar wiring is very forgiving so there is no one "right way" to do it.  Hopefully the method I described helps somebody solve a problem somewhere, and if it does please post something and let me know how it went!

(There's no preview of the photos so I hope the image size turns out okay.)
 

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I came across I think a video on YouTube a while back where separating shielding ground from signal return was used. I'll see if I can find it tomorrow.

Good to get feedback of someone on the forum who has had a good result with this type of wiring.


EDIT:

It wasn't a video but an article on Jimmy Page wiring http://www.newenglandluthiers.org/contents/Articles/Tips_Techniques_Tools/JPLP_wiring/Intro.html

 
sounds interesting.  being a complete moron about how wiring works, do you have a diagram with just one p90?  I can read a diagram VERY well but have no idea how it all works!!! :toothy10:

I have a single could P90 build that I would be interested in using this

thanks
 
Does it change any characteristics of the sound of the P-90?  I've seen people go crazy with Strat shielding, foil tape around coils under pickup covers, etc.  There's no extra resistors and caps involved with that, but they inherently sound different.
 
The resistors and extra cap aren't part of the grounding scheme. That's just my goofy tone circuit, trying to dial in a useful knob for the baritone. Just replace it with a single cap and change the potentiometer to 500k for the traditional circuit.

It might take me a couple days to get to my computer and draw a single P90 circuit. You'd just remove one pickup and toggle switch, not much different to what I've drawn.
 
Looks like a depiction of a twisted/shielded pair.

Overall, I can't see how any of this mitigates any of the inherent P90 noise.
 
Correct, that is a shielded twisted pair. I just used it to be thorough.

The most bang for the buck is the thick metal cover over the P90 coils. It is thick enough to absorb low frequency E-field noise while allowing the H-field signal from the vibrating string to pass through.  But that shielding would be undermined if the P90 cover is attached to the return wire at the P90. The idea is to drain the noise away from your signal on the chassis ground, and keep it apart from your signal's circuit.

The key really is to separate the chassis ground from the signal returns until connecting them at a single point at the output jack.  The magnetic pickup creates a differential signal on 2 conductors, which is why I drew out the return wires on a schematic. It is an oversimplification to just "go to ground" with these circuits on a schematic because it is a differential signal.
 
This thread has really bothered me for the last two days.

I wasn't going to comment but I don't get it...

If I wanted a noiseless guitar, I wouldn't start with P-90 pickups.

Just saying that there are better starting points.
 
DavyDave53 said:
If I wanted a noiseless guitar, I wouldn't start with P-90 pickups.

Well, P90s have a rather unique character to them, so I can understand somebody wanting that. But, they are noisy little rascals and there's little you can do about it. Bill Lawrence designed some noiseless P90s, but you don't hear of them very often. Not sure why. Low advertising budget, most likely.
 
I'm not looking to revive this thread, but DMRACO had asked for a wiring diagram for a single P90, so I've attached that with the traditional tone circuit shown.

Apologies for not being able to get to it sooner.

Good luck all and happy soldering!
 

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