fretless conversion - fingerboard removal

[swarfrat]

So I found a donor bass cheap (Ibanez TMB105) There not being ANY unlined fretless 5-strings p-basses on the market in budget friendly prices - I'm thinking about defretting it. I've seen some discussion other places but I thought I'd ask the folks I know:

What do you think about filling/dying/epoxy vs just completely replacing the fingerboard? LMII sells fingerboard blanks. I don't really need to save the stock fingerboard. It's an Ibanez, not a Fender pocket so it's not like I can just order a Warmoth neck for it. In fact, there aren't really any good donor bodies out there either.

I might attempt to remove the fingerboard but I could always just rout it off if that proves to be a problem. I've done a body from scratch but never a neck. LMII will radius the blank. I suppose I could probably stain and epoxy it off the neck, then glue it for a zero run zero cleanup job. But what's involved in setting up a radiused fingerboard? Is it just glue it on, final sand, and adjust the truss rod? Is there more? Is this a stupidly steep learning curve?

 

[DaveT]

Just remove the frets.
The more care you use, the less work it takes to clean up the results.
I did it untold years ago. Crudely.
A bit of work with some sandpaper and job done.

Remove the fingerboard... Are you mad?

 

[swarfrat]

Mad? Perhaps, but we established that at "fretless". I've never seen a defretted fingerboard that came out unlined though.

 

[PhilHill]

I don't know if you've ever removed a fretboard, but it not something you want to do if you don't have to. Depending on the adhesive used to attach it, removal can be an absolute nightmare. You would be far better off to pull the frets and fill the slots with thin strips of wood, either the same wood as the board or something contrasting.
And installing a new board on an existing neck calls for the neck to be COMPLETELY clean of the old board and both the new board and the neck need to be very nearly the same width. Then comes the lovely experience of trying to clamp them together without anything moving on you.
If all this sounds like something you want to do, then go for it. I would be willing to advise where I can, but I really think the best advice I could give would be to pull the frets and fill with wood. Then sand with a radius block. But good luck either way. :icon_thumright:

 

[DangerousR6]

I'd have to agree with Phill, removing the whole fretboard could be a bigger problem. I believe I'd just remove the frets as carefully as possible and try and find some wood of the same type and color and make a slurry of epoxy and wood shavings to fill in the slots...

 

[amigarobbo]

You can do the fills the same wood/shade as the rest of the fret fingerboard and it kinda hides it, but you as the player can see those helpful little lines  ccasion14:

The main problem is hiding the position dots.

Personally, I'd do it the easy way myself. As always. Then if I really didn't like it you could still take the fingerboard off and replace it.

 

[swarfrat]

That's why I was asking. I actually wondered if popping the fingerboard off and gluing a new  one on was easier

 

[guitarstv]

I've removed a fretboard from a beloved old worthless acoustic with a broken truss rod.  It wasn't worth repairing, and I didn't really have anything to lose at that point.  Had no prior experience and great success in the removal.  Basically the process was:

- take an x-acto blade and score where the fretboard (binding in this case) meets the neck so that the finish won't chip
- take an iron on high heat and sit it on the frets until they're hella hot
- take a very sharp paint scraper and gently work it between the fretboard and the neck where you've heated things up with the iron
- keep slowly moving the iron down the frets as you keep working the paint scraper further between the two pieces of wood

It took about two hours and came off cleanly with no damage to the neck.  Then there were several hours of painstakingly removing the old glue from the board and the neck.  Unfortunately, gluing the board back on turned out to be beyond my skills.  The first time I tried I didn't clamp it tightly enough and there was a slight gap between the board and the neck around the 12th fret bass side.  So I went through the whole process again and clamped the neck down harder . . . managing to crack the neck in the process.  Ended up having to junk it. 

I'd rank replacing the fretboard on a guitar as pretty hard to do.  Much harder than pulling frets and epoxying the gaps smooth.

 

[DangerousR6]

I've removed a fretboard from a beloved old worthless acoustic with a broken truss rod.  It wasn't worth repairing, and I didn't really have anything to lose at that point.  Had no prior experience and great success in the removal.  Basically the process was:

- take an x-acto blade and score where the fretboard (binding in this case) meets the neck so that the finish won't chip
- take an iron on high heat and sit it on the frets until they're hella hot
- take a very sharp paint scraper and gently work it between the fretboard and the neck where you've heated things up with the iron
- keep slowly moving the iron down the frets as you keep working the paint scraper further between the two pieces of wood

It took about two hours and came off cleanly with no damage to the neck.  Then there were several hours of painstakingly removing the old glue from the board and the neck.  Unfortunately, gluing the board back on turned out to be beyond my skills.  The first time I tried I didn't clamp it tightly enough and there was a slight gap between the board and the neck around the 12th fret bass side.  So I went through the whole process again and clamped the neck down harder . . . managing to crack the neck in the process.  Ended up having to junk it. 

I'd rank replacing the fretboard on a guitar as pretty hard to do.  Much harder than pulling frets and epoxying the gaps smooth.

Nice work, but I think I would have made some sort of index first to get the fretboard back in the correct spot.

 

[PhilHill]

I've removed a fretboard from a beloved old worthless acoustic with a broken truss rod.  It wasn't worth repairing, and I didn't really have anything to lose at that point.  Had no prior experience and great success in the removal.  Basically the process was:

- take an x-acto blade and score where the fretboard (binding in this case) meets the neck so that the finish won't chip
- take an iron on high heat and sit it on the frets until they're hella hot
- take a very sharp paint scraper and gently work it between the fretboard and the neck where you've heated things up with the iron
- keep slowly moving the iron down the frets as you keep working the paint scraper further between the two pieces of wood

It took about two hours and came off cleanly with no damage to the neck.  Then there were several hours of painstakingly removing the old glue from the board and the neck.  Unfortunately, gluing the board back on turned out to be beyond my skills.  The first time I tried I didn't clamp it tightly enough and there was a slight gap between the board and the neck around the 12th fret bass side.  So I went through the whole process again and clamped the neck down harder . . . managing to crack the neck in the process.  Ended up having to junk it. 

I'd rank replacing the fretboard on a guitar as pretty hard to do.  Much harder than pulling frets and epoxying the gaps smooth.

That was a good process for removal with a board that's been put on with an adhesive that softens with heat. And the finish on that guitar evidently wasn't too thick to start with, as that can determine how easy it scores for removal. Acoustics frequently are assembled this way, as its likely that at some point the neck may have to be removed. Necks for solid bodies aren't always done with that type of adhesive, as it's more likely the neck will be replaced rather than repaired nowadays. Factories nowadays worry more about using an adhesive that can be cured fast and will give the strongest bond as the bond between the board and the neck has to be strong or the truss rod will pop it off again. Titebond or hide glue can be this strong if all other factors are proper, but they take awhile to cure and that may not fit production schedules.
Yes, the process of putting the board back on is deceptively simple looking at first, not so in practice.

 

[guitarstv]

Nice work, but I think I would have made some sort of index first to get the fretboard back in the correct spot.

Issue wasn't getting the board back into the correct spot (that wasn't too hard) . . . it was that when clamping I wasn't able to get even/firm pressure all the way around the fretboard.  I later saw that stew mac sells something that's like a gigantic elastic band for wrapping around and clamping together irregular surfaces.  If I'd had one of these I bet it would have worked out.  That's what I'd recommend to anyone trying to do the same.

 

[swarfrat]

NBD - found one used. I think for now I'll just set it up with Chrome/Flats and evaluate it. I realized that I can now sell my 4-string Squier P-bass and my Douglass 5 that I've never bonded with. So... if I sell two cheap basses, I might consider another, and convert this one down the road. Or maybe I'll spring for a Warmoth - I just hate to dump too much money into something I know is likely the latest rabbit hole.  But I might could find a Squier 5J and replace the pickguard and neck.