Fender's ridiculous RRPs in Australia...

[Axkoa]

I saw a video this morning from the youtube channel "intheblues" who is a guitar Youtuber who lives in Melbourne, Australia talking about the prices of Fender guitars in Australia. He makes quite a number of valid points in this video.

[youtube]https://youtu.be/Sb4RcK_dJUw[/youtube]

So I did some "researching myself" and found out that a SQUIER Classic Vibes 60's Strat in Australia, it's RRP goings for $1,099 AUD...

Now even considering exchange rate, that's absolutely mental. That's around $825 USD.

I decided to put together a "cheapish" Warmoth guitar.

Converting that back into AUD it come out as around $1,200 AUD, including freakin' shipping from the USA to Australia...

So for $100 more in Australia you can get a pretty damn decent Warmoth guitar for $100 AUD more than the RRP for a Squier Classic Vibes guitar...

What the hell Fender...

 

[Fat Pete]

Yep, that does seem a bit strong. Even in the UK - not generally great for prices - Fender lists them at £440 - $728 AUD/$546 US.

Look on the bright side - it makes Warmoth an even easier choice!

 

[Axkoa]

Look on the bright side - it makes Warmoth an even easier choice!

Exactly!

And the Professional Strat is around $3,400 AUD.  :icon_thumright:

 

[Calvinmiki]

I think it's worth a degree.

 

[Tomatonator]

Not that I'm defending it but anything over $1000 including shipping and insurance coming into Aus attracts tax/duty as well unless something has changed which I doubt.

So to get the Warmoth you'd possibly have to split the shipments and even then I think they can be taxed if they're delivered soon after each other. Also the Fenders would come in in shipments of well over $1000 although the tax for companies importing stock probably operates differently. But yeah middle men and rubbish like minimum suggested retail prices suck

 

[mayfly]

I was going to say that at those prices I don't know why you're all not playing Maton guitars....


... but then I looked up the prices of Maton guitars!    Those are some expensive instruments!  I thought they were kind of like Godin here in Canada.  But sadly I guess not. 

 

[Axkoa]

Not that I'm defending it but anything over $1000 including shipping and insurance coming into Aus attracts tax/duty as well unless something has changed which I doubt.

So to get the Warmoth you'd possibly have to split the shipments and even then I think they can be taxed if they're delivered soon after each other. Also the Fenders would come in in shipments of well over $1000 although the tax for companies importing stock probably operates differently. But yeah middle men and rubbish like minimum suggested retail prices suck

Yeah I understand what you mean! Taxes here are 10% for anything worth over $1000 for guitars. I have no idea how it would work for Fender...

Australian prices are just messed up.

 

[Tomatonator]

I am, but I bought mine in about 1999 2nd hand for $800 The factory is about 15 mins from me.

The other thing about selling in a foreign currency is unfortunately they would set a price over a given period to benefit from the predicted exchange rate cause customers probably don't like prices changing every week or month.

 

[Tomatonator]

I saw a good post on facebook earlier where I 1st saw the video and someone said we have a culture of walking into a music store and expecting a big discount from the marked price. Lots of prices are messed up in Aus. You go to buy a house and the price is what 10-20% above the "indicated" price they put there just to get a crowd interested enough to turn up.

P.S. Looking forward to seeing Canadian Maton endorsee the Tea Party with symphony orchestra in a couple of weeks

 

[Logrinn]

Something to consider - besides Warmoth, i mean - could be Chapman guitars. I see that there's a couple of Chapman retailers in Australia now.
Music Junction for instance.

How about a Ghost Fret for 749 Aus dollars?

 

[Ace Flibble]

Fender have been increasing their prices in most regions for a while. As most countries' economies keep tanking, sales of superfluous things like electric guitars have gone down.  On top of that there are more and more 'copy' brands coming up, while brands which were seen as second-rate 20 years ago are now viewed as being on-par with the likes of Fender. 'Parts' companies like Warmoth aren't so badly affected because they have always been a vanity purchase, basically; no beginner starts out on a Warmoth build.

It doesn't help that the big brands like Gibson and Fender often get bad-mouthed and generally don't get the kind of insane fan support as brands which are perceived to be smaller or in some way more relatable. Same with amps; if you say you played through a Marshall and it sucks, everybody goes "yeah, figures", but you better not dare say that a Bad Cat sucks or you'll have the mob at your door with torches and pitchforks.
On top of that, smaller companies get to experiment and fulfill gaps in the market which the big brands can't. Mayones or ESP can try anything and be rewarded with strong sales, but Fender better not dare do anything other than make the same-old Strat and Teles or there will be hell to pay. And of course if they just keep making the same old models then their sales go down anyway because everybody already has those.

Combine the two—generally low sales for the whole industry, and backlash for the big companies—and you can see why a company like Fender will start to suffer. In turn, that means they have to start charging more on each instrument. When they aren't able to get away with it in one region (e.g. the US) then another region has to pick up the slack.

Hence, Fender used to be the affordable option, out of the big companies. Now they're just as expensive as Gibson. Gibson has been in this position for longer, so they're a bit more stable. Fender are still adjusting, so expect to see their prices fluctuate a little more. ESP and Schecter are also headed that way. Ibanez are starting to up their prices here and there. DiMarzio and Seymour Duncan are, too. Marshall, Fender, and Orange amps, as well as Boss pedals are going up/will be going up.


The silver lining, if it can be called that, is that it's not just guitars and other musical instruments. It's also happening to cameras, enthusiast computer parts, cars, most premium appliances. When economies keep tanking and a lot of big businesses see their sales drop, they have to put their prices up to keep afloat or they quickly go down under their own weight.

It sucks, especially for regions like Oceania and most of Europe who just get completely dicked over as they often have to make up for the price hikes which America and Japan won't tolerate, but that's the way of the world now. Only thing that can be done is for governments to stop letting the floors drop out of their economies.

 

[musicispeace]

You're going to hate me in Oz when I tell you second hand Squire strats run $80-$200 when I see them in used guitar stores and pawn shops in the US. I had one for awhile I paid $110 for. I agree with the Chapman poster. I went to one of the Chapman Tour stops and got hands on with some of his guitars and had no complaints. Although now he has switched factories and has sort of a two tier range and pricing. Still looks reasonable compared to the big names. Even if a player had to upgrade pots and switches it would be worthwhile. As a second time around player starting from scratch again I went with Warmoth because I had always had in interest in them and refused to pay what Fender and Gibson wanted these days. Plus since I have discovered I like way chunkier necks than factory guitars the parts game is the only game in town for me. I'd probably try a Chapman if i was in the market for a factory new guitar. Note that the Chapman necks seem to tend toward flatter radius, not fat or chunky, and probably the same nut width as most factory guitars.

https://www.chapmanguitars.co.uk/guitars/view-all/

https://www.riffcityguitaroutlet.com/collections/chapman-guitars-1?gclid=CMLyyPmXntMCFQ9EfgodDBwOTg

 

[Kostas]

Here's the live streaming where he talks about the same thing. At some point he says that's a reason why he prefers Japanese guitars now and I have to agree. I have three Asian guitars and the quality of the Japanese is equal with US brands that cost two and three times more!

[youtube]1TDV1L2uAtU[/youtube]

 

[musicispeace]

Here's the live streaming where he talks about the same thing. At some point he says that's a reason why he prefers Japanese guitars now and I have to agree. I have three Asian guitars and the quality of the Japanese is equal with US brands that cost two and three times more!

[youtube]1TDV1L2uAtU[/youtube]

I've seen several of his vids. i like his playing and he reviews equipment normal human beings buy. Originally when I was playing years ago I had a nice Ibanez solid body that was a good guitar period, as well as a solid guitar "for the money." I've heard that in the '60s some of the guitarists that would become household names bought old Gibsons because at the time they were only about a decade old and were cheap at the time. Leslie West has said in interviews he bought LP juniors in part because he could afford them at second hand stores. I'd rather put my money into a good amp to go with a solid Japanese or Korean guitar then be robbed for the price of a new Fender or Gibson. Best to you in your playing and guitar searches.

 

[Wolfie351]

Who pays MSRP?  or RRP? 

If Aus is anything like the US, a guitar with a retail price of $1200 was purchased at a wholesale price about half that, so $600.  If it's a big discount retailer, then probably knock another $100 off that during promotions.  A buyer looking for a really good deal during a sale could probably buy it for $650-$700.  Still expensive for what you are getting, but nowhere near $1200.  But, with that said...if you don't like it, don't buy it.  Protest with your wallet.

 

[Axkoa]

Who pays MSRP?  or RRP? 

If Aus is anything like the US, a guitar with a retail price of $1200 was purchased at a wholesale price about half that, so $600.  If it's a big discount retailer, then probably knock another $100 off that during promotions.  A buyer looking for a really good deal during a sale could probably buy it for $650-$700.  Still expensive for what you are getting, but nowhere near $1200.  But, with that said...if you don't like it, don't buy it.  Protest with your wallet.

Yeah exactly.  :binkybaby:

The Squire currently sells for around $700 over here. It was just the RRP was put up for the guitars recently. The Mexican Standard Strat's RRP is $1500...

 

[T89Rex]

That nobody actually pays RRP doesn't make what they're doing any less obscene. The reduction from RRP also tends to be smaller here than what I understand it is in the States owing to smaller population, fewer music stores and less competition etc. Perhaps the only thing bringing the prices closer into line is that advertised prices here include tax.

You're right, if it's too extreme you can just not buy, but I like having guitar stores nearby. I want to support local businesses, but they're being gouged by the wholesaler and have no choice but to gouge me in turn. The result is that I buy a Warmoth instead, the local guitar shop gets one less sale and moves that little bit closer to closing its doors. I pay overs on strings and picks to try to mitigate that, but I have the luxury of a disposable income that allows me to do so. Plenty of other people will just buy ten packs on eBay or Amazon for half the price per unit and you can hardly blame them.

There's just no justifiable reason beyond greed and exploitation of a captive market (particularly now that there are restrictions on the movement of rosewood across borders) for the price difference being what it is. When I can buy Warmoth parts, pay somebody to assemble them, and then pay for the completed guitar to be sent to me (at consumer rates rather than the commercial deal a major corporation would get) all for less than a Fender assembled in a factory in a country chosen specifically to keep labour costs down, something is seriously wrong. Some will say that's capitalism at work and fine, maybe it is, but that's not going to stop me calling out a greedy corporation that's long since given up on believing in anything other than its bottom line.

 

[stratamania]

It isn't just contained to Fender or Australia. I am seeing prices increasing for musical goods that even when you take into account devalued currencies, leading to poorer exchange rates for imports and things such as VAT they are still high.

Currently, 2799 US Dollar equals 2229.12 GBP, which in the US Apple will sell you a 15inch Macbook Pro, but in the UK it's £2699.

But that would have been the same even if the UK pound to USD was where it was a year ago.

I am constantly seeing prices being increased here and there for all sorts of things but in a lot of cases earnings in some sectors are barely any different to what they were 10 years ago.

Life is a Lemon

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cAWGjbLvXU[/youtube]

 

[nullref]

Currently, 2799 US Dollar equals 2229.12 GBP, which in the US Apple will sell you a 15inch Macbook Pro, but in the UK it's £2699.

But isn't that £2699 including VAT?  If so, that wouldn't be a fair comparison since the US price is before tax.

 

[stratamania]

Currently, 2799 US Dollar equals 2229.12 GBP, which in the US Apple will sell you a 15inch Macbook Pro, but in the UK it's £2699.

But isn't that £2699 including VAT?  If so, that wouldn't be a fair comparison since the US price is before tax.

Yes, it is including VAT. But when you consider that was worth about $4300 odd dollars about a year ago pre Brexit vote.
Even if you remove the VAT it's still almost $3600. This is not far out when I bought an MBP in 2015.

That would tend to point to a few things, the pound is undervalued which it is.

That Apple, in this case, has been charging almost the same types of prices in the UK for several years regardless of exchange rates indicates profiteering or charging what they can get away with. Now with less favorable exchange rates for the UK I don't see Apple absorbing a loss.

If this is the case it would tend to suggest the US prices themselves are also far higher than they otherwise could be. Certainly, lots of folks have done price type comparisons for equivalent spec'd PCs and found them to be more cost effective.