Compensated Nuts - 12 string?

[swarfrat]

I've had my Earvana nut on my main strat for a month or two now. It rocks. And now that I've got my 12 string back and it's the guitar that sitting out for a week or two, it's driving me nuts (no pun intended).

I know its been done. See Steven Delft's article. And LMI's Intonation article. I mean what's the point on jangling if you're not gonna jangle in tune?
And the voicing of the 12 draws you to open registers anyway, where the nut compensation makes the most difference.

Anyone ever attempt or have a compensated 12 string nut done? Who did it and how'd it turn out for you?

 

[B3Guy]

IDK . . . there's a point at which you just need to let sleeping dogs stay asleep, IMO. In researching guitar stuff, I spent a lot of time of the "imperfect tuning" of guitars and guitar necks. At first I thought about a compensating nut . . . than about True Temperament necks, then I thought . . . ef it, 99% of musicians play on these so-called "imperfect" instruments, none of them care, and some of them make a mint at it too. Don't sweat it. spend your time playing and practicing. learn a new lick.

 

[Mor Paul]

I think some of the 12-string sound is that slight bit of out-of-tuneness.

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

Yeah, it's kind of a damned if you do, damned if you don't thing.  Most of us are not the only instrument in the band.  Steve Vai has a TT neck, but other than the Youtube stuff of him showing it off, does it ever go on stage with him?  Maybe, but IDK.  If you could get a whole band to go TT and have the drummer tune his toms, you're in business, but most musicians are not as accomodating.  I for one wouldn't go out and invest in new stuff just because of another band memeber's appetite for perfection.  There's in tune and there's in tune.  Most of the best music ever made is far from perfect.

 

[swarfrat]

I've seen all the compensating nuts arguing against compensated nuts already. It's not like you're trying to play well tempered guitar in a big band or something like that.  If you have a keyboard, they're almost certainly equal tempered and intonated. If you have another guitar player(s) I hope you're not all sawing away in root position. It's not even like ALL your notes are out of tune, it's just the first few frets that make a difference. But i didn't ask that. I asked:

Has anyone had this done? Who did it? How did you like it?

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

All good points.

 

[B3Guy]

if your 12-string has adjustable bridge saddles, and the same scale length as your guitar with the Earvana, just copy (gasp) the earvana and cut double the slots for strings as on your six shooter.

 

[swarfrat]

The octave strings require radically different compensation.

 

[B3Guy]

wait . . . wow. shows how much I know about 12s. I was thinking they were pairs of identical strings, like on a mandolin. my bad.

 

[swarfrat]

The bottom four courses are octaves. The top two are unisons, although I'm on the verge of experimenting with stringing as a 10 string and leaving the top two unisons as single, specifically for open ringing crunchy chimey cowboy chords. (Another reason I want to get the thing meticulously intonated - distortion really uglifies minor tuning discrepancies.

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

The bottom four courses are octaves. The top two are unisons, although I'm on the verge of experimenting with stringing as a 10 string and leaving the top two unisons as single, specifically for open ringing crunchy chimey cowboy chords. (Another reason I want to get the thing meticulously intonated - distortion really uglifies minor tuning discrepancies.

B.C. Rich did this for that reason.  Less muddy if doing anything but clean.  Brilliant execution too.  Turn the headstock into a hardtail for the octave strings.  No confusing tuning issues (or added weight) with more than 6 tuners on the headstock.

 

[bagman67]

The bottom four courses are octaves. The top two are unisons, although I'm on the verge of experimenting with stringing as a 10 string and leaving the top two unisons as single, specifically for open ringing crunchy chimey cowboy chords. (Another reason I want to get the thing meticulously intonated - distortion really uglifies minor tuning discrepancies.

B.C. Rich did this for that reason.  Less muddy if doing anything but clean.  Brilliant execution too.  Turn the headstock into a hardtail for the octave strings.  No confusing tuning issues (or added weight) with more than 6 tuners on the headstock.

Obviously you're on your own for figuring how to get the BC Rich solution installed on a guitar that isn't, how shall I put this, aesthetically challenged in the visual mode.

HTH, HAND -

Bagman

 

[ORCRiST]

The bottom four courses are octaves. The top two are unisons, although I'm on the verge of experimenting with stringing as a 10 string and leaving the top two unisons as single, specifically for open ringing crunchy chimey cowboy chords. (Another reason I want to get the thing meticulously intonated - distortion really uglifies minor tuning discrepancies.

B.C. Rich did this for that reason.  Less muddy if doing anything but clean.  Brilliant execution too.  Turn the headstock into a hardtail for the octave strings.  No confusing tuning issues (or added weight) with more than 6 tuners on the headstock.

Obviously you're on your own for figuring how to get the BC Rich solution installed on a guitar that isn't, how shall I put this, aesthetically challenged in the visual mode.

HTH, HAND -

Bagman

Lol... very diplomatic Bagman...  :laughing7:

ORC

 

[swarfrat]

It could be done. Straight pull tuners through the body? Steinberger tuners for the ones behind the bridge?Might want a Steinberger M style cutaway behind the bridge for access and thickness, but it'd be less radical than the BC Rich.

But if you name the guitar "Bich" you can sidestep the whole aesthetics and what other people think about it point quite forcefully if not exactly deftly.

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

Not that much of a challenge if one is handy with a router and drill.  Install ferrules in the headstock, relocate the strap button, and route the end of the body thin enough for the tuners to mount in the strap button area of the body.  One could even recess it so the tuners wouldn't contact the ground when not playing.  The trickiest part would be the bridge.  One could use the B.C. Rich one, or regular 12 string Stop tail with the strings traveling the stop tail to the tuners, or a Tele 12 string with the octave strings' path notched out in the back of the bridge.  Might not look OEM, but certainly less hideous than the B.C. Rich.

But like the OP stated earlier, he didn't ask this.

Not my best work, but you get the idea.