Body types for EMG HxH or HHx setup?

[TheDrizzle]

Hi all,

First post.  Good times.

I'm a 20 year guitar noodler (I admittedly suck, but I'm OK with that) and I've been looking to get a second guitar for some time.  I currently have a Epi LP soemthing-or-other, mid range job (I think like $400?), which is fine, but I go to shops when I can to try other things out.  After years of window shopping and playing around, I narrowed down my wish list to two guitars that just felt head and shoulders above the rest in ease of play on the fretboard.  I don't know if this is the way they were set up, the strings - no idea, but I loved them:

1 was an ESP M-II with OFR and rosewood fingerboard (bolt on I think)
the other was a Buddy Blaze shredder

So I was going to go down into the city to noodle one more time, and see if I could play an M-II again, so invited a friend to come with me.

He's worked at a music store for years, and when he mentioned he would help be build my own, I was all for it since I have been perusing the Warmoth site and playing with thier 'build your own' interface for some time (liked it much better when they showed the body as you built it... what happened to that?).

He is pretty confident that we can build something that 'feels' like the ESP when it;s done, which is great.

So I will apologize up front since I'm going to probably bombard everyone with nubie questions about all the options, but my first is:

If I want to have an EMG setup (either HxH or HHx like the Shredder), what body types do I have to rule out?  I dont' think I can choose a Jaguar for example.  Any there any other constraints?

I'm intrigued with building a metal-esque Tele, but then thought about the other shapes as well.  For instance I like Dan Donegan's Schecter look:

So I want to not limit myself, since I will probably only be able to do this once.

As for the EMGs, I'm looking to play a decent range of music, but more 80's metal, modern metal/rock etc.  I'm not married to the EMGs, but my buddy is recommending that I get them for what I want to play.  Either way I'm looking at HxH or HHx.

Thanks all!  I'll try not to pester you too much.

 

[swarfrat]

Look at the Z. Ugly, but functional.

 

[TheDrizzle]

Look at the Z. Ugly, but functional.

Not really looking for ugly.  Not a fan of the big horn or off-kilter look of the Z.

I dont' think I want to go too metal with the shape.  V/modified V is tough to sit and play.  X-Bird and Star are a bit too 'metal or die' for my taste.

Really trying to rule things out based on inability to set up the way I want in terms of pups.

Oh yeah - I also want rear route!  Not a fan of pickguards.  I already pulled it off my Epi, along with the little circles under the knobs (which I replaced with shotgun shell knobs, which are pretty badass for those who want to switch out).

Also whoever sets up the questions you have to answer to post - last year was 2012! =)

 

[line6man]

I'm just curious why you would want a HHx setup? Seems rather useless, and there are not many guitars with that setup. HxH is a tried-and-true standard, and it gives plenty of versatility.

 

[bagman67]

If you're trying to accommodate a 24-fret board, HHX is not the answer  -  HXH with the 24-fret mod is.


Also, if you're going metal, how about a soloist?  Countless metalhead enthusiasts can't be wrong.  Or rather, they can easily all be wrong, but this seems an unlikely area for that kind of coincidence.


Bagman

 

[TheDrizzle]

I'm just curious why you would want a HHx setup? Seems rather useless, and there are not many guitars with that setup. HxH is a tried-and-true standard, and it gives plenty of versatility.

That's what the Buddy Blaze has, so I wanted to give myself the option.  I'll probably go HxH when it's all said and done to be honest.  I doubt there is a guitar body that offers HxH and not HHx though, so I'm not too concerned at this point.

Maybe I'm posting it in the wrong order.  Bridge, Middle, no Neck.  That may be xHH.

Bag - def considering soloist.  That's probably my 'fallback', but I thought it would be cool to have kind of a 'stealth' metal guitar like a tele/Jazzmaster etc with the EMGs.

 

[swarfrat]

I've thought a few times about HHx with some kind of hum cancelling jangly thing in the middle position. I'm intrigued by it.

 

[bagman67]

Bag - def considering soloist.  That's probably my 'fallback', but I thought it would be cool to have kind of a 'stealth' metal guitar like a tele/Jazzmaster etc with the EMGs.

Our own DeathByUberschall has an insanely gorgeous metal-flavored Tele with EMG's in blue quilt maple - check it out.  I'm sure if you look for posts by him in the Tele gallery subforum you'll find it before long.

 

[Patrick from Davis]

The ESP is similar to a soloist with a carved top.  ESP also has a seven string guitar with the HHx set up, Devin Townsend used to play one, and I think it was the guy from the Deftones model.  The soloist seems to me to be the more versatile shape while not being over the top metal.  There are a lot of folks that like EMGs around here.  I find they don't work for me.  Ken (Troubled Treble here) from Roadhouse Pickups made me a set of pickups that were marvelous for metal and rock.  The bridge sounds a lot like a Bare Knuckles Pickups Nailbomb.  And Ken is a nice guy, so I prefer to give him my business.
Patrick

 

[TheDrizzle]

Thanks for the input.  I'll def check out that metal tele.

Patrick, how do you like those bare knuckles?  Recommend for what I'm after?  I hate 'picking' tones from pups since so much depends on amp and effects, especially with distortion.  I've heard good things about those BNs though.  Was also considering Blackouts.

As for my initial question, are there bodies I have to cross off the list?

 

[bagman67]

Here you go - Death By Uberschall's "Blue"


http://www.unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=8334.0

 

[Patrick from Davis]

They are full of attitude.  Not as tight as some of the other models, but work really well for going between the metal and rock worlds.  I like Ken's pickups better though.  The ones he made me, the bridge sounds like the BKP bridge, but not as mid hissy, smoother with all of the character.  The neck pickup is something special, not really too comparable to others, ballsy, clear, thick neck pickup sound with a lot of slank as well.  Tough to describe them with words, but I do recommend Ken's Roadhouse pickups, they are a lot cheaper than BKP (if you are in the states) for that sound.  He does something different with how he winds them, you can hear it, and it is a good something.
Patrick

 

[Strat Avenger]

My Warmoth was built to resemble a ESP M-II Custom ( I have a M-II standard and a EC). Of course it's a Jackson "Soloist" body shape, which is very similar but not exact.

I got exactly what I wanted for a fraction of the cost of a Custom Shop ESP, and with the satisfaction of assembling everything myself. The quality and performance is every bit as good too.

 

[TheDrizzle]

@ bag - thanks - that's pretty nice.  The blue looks really nice - I'm not sure if I want to rock the tele bridge though..  But I do like the look of the EMGs.

@ Patrick - I bopped around on the BK site last night, I like the lineup, and the Nailbombs were right up my alley.  Of course who knows what the &^% they would sound like through my guitar and amp etc. =)

I like what you are saying about the stuff from Ken's RH though, I'll def check those out as well.

@ SA - that's good to know, I was hoping to have it come out that way when it's done.  Question for you though - do you think I could get the same result with a switch in body type?  How much of that 'ESP feel' is really from the shape of the body vs. the rest of your choices?

Also, what were those choices, if you don't mind me asking... (specs on 'Warmoth ESP'

 

[Death by Uberschall]

You don't have to put a Tele bridge on a Tele. That's the beauty of Warmoth.  :icon_thumright:

 

[TheDrizzle]

You don't have to put a Tele bridge on a Tele. That's the beauty of Warmoth.  :icon_thumright:

Ooh!  Perfect guy for this question!

If I DO decide to go with a Tele body, what should determine my choice on which one?  There are like 8 of them (Tele, Vintage, Thinline, '72 Thinline, Deluxe, Custom, Cabronita, 7/8th) and I can't tell what the differences are, considering each is customizable - except I assume the 7/8 is a variation of one of them that has a smaller scale length.

Any advice?

 

[SustainerPlayer]

This is based on a La Cabronita body:

But I guess you want more curves on the body? Then go for a carve top.

 

[Death by Uberschall]

You don't have to put a Tele bridge on a Tele. That's the beauty of Warmoth.  :icon_thumright:

Ooh!  Perfect guy for this question!

If I DO decide to go with a Tele body, what should determine my choice on which one?  There are like 8 of them (Tele, Vintage, Thinline, '72 Thinline, Deluxe, Custom, Cabronita, 7/8th) and I can't tell what the differences are, considering each is customizable - except I assume the 7/8 is a variation of one of them that has a smaller scale length.

Any advice?

For heavier styles of music I would build the basic Tele body (solid or chambered). Mine is chambered. Any design with a true hollow body design will be a problem at hight gain and volume levels.

Determine if you want more of a Les Paul or Fender tone (darker or brighter tone). Once you do that we can make suggestions. But like I stated, the beauty of Warmoth is the ability to build it the way you want. EMGs will fit in just about any body you're thinking about, so don't worry about that.

 

[Strat Avenger]

@ SA - that's good to know, I was hoping to have it come out that way when it's done.  Question for you though - do you think I could get the same result with a switch in body type?  How much of that 'ESP feel' is really from the shape of the body vs. the rest of your choices?

Also, what were those choices, if you don't mind me asking... (specs on 'Warmoth ESP'

I wanted a Custom Shop ESP, but not interested in spending 4 or 5 grand for something that I could build myself for $1400. I even had USACG custom-shape the headstock to resemble the ESP "vintage" shape (for an up-charge).

The difference in the bodies has no affect on the feel as far as my experience has been.

My "choices" consisted of an alder body with S-X-H pickup configuration, Original Floyd Rose (recessed), 1 volume control (no "tone" controls), one 3-way toggle switch with center-position coil splitting (the same one John Petrucci uses in his Music Man signature guitars), ESP-style contoured heel (I got the neck plate from a scrapped out "LTD"), a "greenburst" finish, body-mounted pickups: Seymour Duncan "Screamin' Demon" bridge and Dimarzio "Fast Track-1" neck, and Dunlop strap locks.

For the neck, a 10"-16" compound radius 25-1/2" scale quarter-sawn maple with dark Indian Rosewood fretboard , 22 medium-jumbo frets (SS 6150), paua-abalone dot inlays, "C-shape" back with a thickness of .760" - .830" (thinner than Warmoth's "Standard Thin", but thicker than a "Wizard".  My ESP M-II standard has a neck thickness of .795" - .866").

The W Standard Thin is .800" - .850", which is pretty close to what I like, but I wish they'd offer a .780" - .850". You can't see the 20 thousandths difference, but you can feel it.

There are 2 graphite reinforcement rods inside to prevent neck twist.
Tuners are Sperzel lockers. All hardware is black.

The guitar weighs 7 pounds, and is the lightest of all my electrics. The others all weigh in at 8 pounds.

F.Y.I.:  My M-II is from 2006, and has the "Thin U" contour, which is no different from a "C" contour, ESP just calls it a "U", but all of the current M-IIs have the "Extra Thin Flat" contour, which I really don't like. The thickness is not the issue; it's the flatness. I like the back of the neck to be round, not flat. Your preference may be different. If you like the Extra Thin Flat, then go with the "Wizard" neck that Warmoth offers. If you like the Thin U, the Standard Thin is pretty darn close (better, in my opinion).

 

[TheDrizzle]

DbU: assuming I can go HxH with any of them, I guess I can bop around on the site and see the differences on the Tele detail pages, thanks.

SA:lots of good info there, much obliged.  I played a few guitars over the weekend, and I liked the regular Tele neck to be my favorite, which was thin but not crazy thin.  I also played an Ibanez Prestige with a super thin neck. It was ok but I think I liked Tele neck better.

I also found a factory HxH Tele with a huge neck profile.  Not a fan.