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anyone have any experience with the Warmoth "Super Wide" necks?

hachikid

Senior Member
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I'm thinking about getting a neck made that has a 1 7/8" nut on it, but I'm wondering about the pickup spacing. if I used a Fender style bridge, would I just be able to use all "bridge pickup" sized pickups in all three positions, and have the pole pieces still line up?

anyone have any other input they can offer about these wider necks?
 
hachikid said:
I'm thinking about getting a neck made that has a 1 7/8" nut on it, but I'm wondering about the pickup spacing. if I used a Fender style bridge, would I just be able to use all "bridge pickup" sized pickups in all three positions, and have the pole pieces still line up?

anyone have any other input they can offer about these wider necks?

Uhm...why??
 
The neck is always 2 3/16" at the heel, even on the "super-wide" versions, so the pickups don't care about the width of the nut. Neither does the bridge, for that matter.
 
true, but the heel of the neck has nothing to do with the string spacing. the nut has a lot more to do with the spacing of the strings, last time I checked...

and the bridge will affect the spacing of the strings over the pole pieces, as well...
 
Think about it. If the neck heel is 2 3/16" wide, can your strings be spaced any wider than that? Of course not. If they were, you couldn't fret them - they'd be hanging out in the air with nothing beneath them. If you even space them close to that you'll be sorry, as they'll fall off the fretboard all the time. And how much narrower than that would make sense? 2 1/16"? 2"? anything narrower than that would be a huge waste of fretboard space. That's just the bridge.

The nut is different. You can move that around quite a bit, relatively speaking. It's ~18" away. If the pivot point is the heel, leverage will diminish the effect of changing the width of nut. You could take the nut all the way out to the width of the heel and not have a great deal of effect on the string spacing over the pickups.
 
hachikid said:
I'm wondering about the pickup spacing.
if I used a Fender style bridge, would I just be able to use all "bridge pickup" sized pickups in all three positions, and have the pole pieces still line up?
1st  -- up ....
Which exact fender style bridge are you talking about ?  :dontknow:

If it's over 50 mm string spread, usually you go for a Trembucker in the bridge.
(all thou you can get away with up to 52 mm) using standard humbucker.
http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/faq/frequently-asked/everything-else/what_does_tremb/
*Note ..... Trembuckers only come in the bridge position !!
So the standard humbuckers for middle and neck must be ok. As thats all you can get.

I've got Humbuckers in the bridge, where I should have Trembucker's  :doh:  on 2 guitars ..... still sound darn fine to me.
(something to change around when I get bored)

*Note ... Don't worry so much about your Nut size, as it's the Bridge string spread, which is of most concern.
(As the bridge is closer to the pups than the nut is)

Something like SD Invaders, only come in one size (humbucker) For both N & B positions.
It's because they have large pole pieces and will fit any string spread.
SD pups with rails ie: hot / cold / dimebucker will work with any string spread too.
Or Dimarzio's X2N or alike.

Dimarzio ... call it F-spacing not Trembuckers like SD do.
http://www.dimarzio.com/sites/default/files/diagrams/DMHBdim.pdf

http://www.dimarzio.com/support/installation-and-dimensions#1-1-1-1

Pickups pole pieces aren't made to the nut sizes, there made to the bridge string spread.
 
I agree - If you were to draw a centerline on the standard and super wide necks (at the nut) your spacing at the bridge would have a neglible effect.  If you're concerned, draw it up on a piece of chart paper.  choose your scale length and set the bridge the same in both layouts, and draw out the 1 11/16 neck versus the 1 7/8 neck; nevermind....

From the attached file you can see that the neck pickup has a slight deviation from the standard to the superwide Warmoth.  That said, it's ABSOLUTELY nothing to sweat.  The magnets are going to capture the vibrations just as well.  I'm sure if you're super worried about it that Seymour Duncan will custom wire you one for the neck that matches the pole/string lineup.  IMHO it's a waste of cash; they're about double what the normal pup would cost.

Cheers man - good luck with the quest
 

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Street Avenger said:
Pickups will not be an issue, but strings being too close to the edge of the fretboard WILL be.

If it's a warmoth, then the fret board is 1/16" wider on each side of the neck for a superwide.
 
I've got the superwide neck on my build. I'm just learning to play, so I figured I'd get the widest neck available and then carve it down as I gain experience and find what suits me the best. I'll get a lot of practice making new nuts! I'm finishing it in clear nitro so sanding it down and refinishing it won't be an issue.
What's been previously stated is all true. The only spacing, that has any real effect on the strings over the pickups, is at the bridge. The small amount of extra width at the nut transates to a negligalbe amount at the pickup poles.
 
I had one and really liked it. I let a bass player try the thing out and he loved it too. It really feels cool, but switching between that and my other necks (1 11/16") was a HUGE difference. Finally sold the thing. It was a really cool neck though. And I'd go Standard Thin, you'll be surprised how the width of the neck can make it seem more thick. My favorite neck is a Fat Back profile. The Superwide necks are definitely very cool. Acoustic-like feel to them, and like I said before, almost a bass-like feel to them too (perfect for you?! :icon_thumright: )
 
I have one on a custom tele build with 2 humbuckers.  The neck I ordered was the cheapest you could get, maple with rosewood fretboard, unfinished, etc.  I did all the maple in Tru-Oil and put it together myself.  In seconds, I hated the stupid lumps on the side of the neck where it meets the body, and also the heal on the back of the neck.  I used a heavy file and then different sandpapers to remove those things.  Afterward, I treated the maple neck with Tru-Oil and was pretty happy with it for a couple of years.  Recently, I realized my fatigue was coming from a neck too thick.  So, I sanded down the Superwide about 2mm and reapplied the Tru-Oil.  It is now the most comfortable, best playing, and fantastic sounding electric guitar I've ever played.  Granted, this is also the 4th set of tuners, and 4th set of pickups before finding the "right" thing.
 
Why do you want the pole pieces to line up? Functionally, it makes little to no difference.

But then, function rarely comes first in my book.
 
superwide_2.jpg

The fretboard actually does overhang the pocket.
 
I'm not sure the overhang is a Bad Thing. It depends on what you're used to. Somebody who's classically trained on a concert/classical guitar would not be so dependent on the neck contour/thickness, as they're taught to keep their palms off the neck and their thumbs behind it rather than gripping the neck for dear life and hanging the weight of their hand off the thumb over the top of the fretboard. Gives them much greater control over what they're doing, with the attendant accuracy. It also means they don't feel most of that stuff.

Teachers jammed that stuff down my throat for years, and I fought it tooth, fang and claw as it's difficult to do. But, it works. You still end up being a sloppy bastard, but it's always better to have a close relationship and familiarity with the rules before you disobey them.
 
A couple of points to address.

(1) I thought the Warmoth "wide" neck had more to do with taper (change in width from nut to heel). Like, at a fast check, my Strat goes from 43mm at the nut to just over 52mm at fret 12; my acoustic is 43.5 - 54.5; my Washburn electric (very LP-like) is 41.5 - 51.5 -- three different tapers, albeit 9mm/11mm/10mm.

(2) there are two de facto "standard" pole spacings for guitar pickups, particularly HBs. This is because "classic" HBs were for Gibson guitars, so 49-50mm center-to-center. But then we started putting HBs in wang-bar Strats, which are 52-53mm. Eventually, wider "F-spaced" pickups like the Trembucker arrived.

(3) I used to agree that a narrow HB at a Strat bridge position made not a lick of sonic difference, though IMO it LOOKS rather dorky. :tard: But then I played a modded Strat at a shop... & the high E was barely there -- the other five had both the proper shimmer & crunch, but that E was quiet & not toneful. Sure enough, the polepiece was about centered between the E & B.
In the next year, I got a pair of used Corts (Sterling & Viva Gold), both totally stock... & both with narrow bridge HBs. The Sterling isn't so bad -- but being a stoptail it puzzles me -- with the outer edge of the E polepiece lined up with the string. However, I certainly CAN hear that the E's output is slightly less than the B, whether clean or cranked. YMMV, & I don't worship at either church, but this is what my ears tell me in these two cases.

(4) back to the OP: the phrase "Fender bridge" is iffy. A whang-bar Fender could have string spacing of 2-7/32" or 2-1/16".
 
re: point [3] - it's more likely that particular guitar wasn't ringing the high "E" very well, rather than the pickup's pole spacing affecting its sensing of it.

It is as you say - improper spacing looks wrong. But, the pickup's performance isn't affected as much as you might imagine.

It helps to think of the pickup as an inverted transformer.

In a traditional transformer you have at least two isolated coils of wire, commonly called the "primary" and "secondary" windings, which are wound around a common ferrous metal core ("ferrous" is French for iron and its alloys). Due primarily to magic (or, what heathens call "intelligent design"), passing an electrical current through a conductor creates a magnetic field. This field infects the ferrous core. Out of an outrageous sense of entitlement, any other conductors in the area will use that field to produce a relative electrical current, less some taxation. The effect can be transformative, in that there can be a ratio between the exciting current in the conductive "primary" and the parasitic result in the "secondary" windings. Hence the name "Transformer". Done properly, 12 volts in can be 70,000 volts out. Don't believe me? Pull a spark plug wire off your car's engine, and stick your tongue in the connector while you have a friend crank the engine over. For added fun, do it in the rain in your bare feet.

Hurts, don't it? That'll learn ya. You'll find your gas-powered lawnmower is equally sadistic.

TalosianGroup.jpg


Wrong thinking will be punished. Right thinking will be as quickly rewarded.

Anyway, a guitar pickup works sorta the same way, only instead of creating a magnetic field by passing an electrical current through the primary winding, the magnetic field is already there in the form of a permanently magnetized core. So, now instead of varying the current in the primary to create a varying magnetic field and induce some blood-sucking on the secondary side, we create a varying magnetic field by bouncing the primary winding (the guitar string) around inside a pre-existing magnetic field. The secondary of this goofy transformer is about 5,000 winds of superfine wire. So, we end up with a ratio of 1:5000, give or take a few. Still only produces millivolts, so go ahead and put your tongue on the output if you'd like. No lessons to be learned there.

I said all that so I could say this: sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Wait... that's not it.

Oh, yeah. The magnetic field set up in a guitar pickup's core is fairly broad relative to its height. So, pole spacing isn't as important as you might imagine. I mean, there are limits, but F spacing vs. "regular" (as in Seth Lover's PAF design) is more of a cosmetic thing than anything else.
 
Wow!  "Magnets and Miracles"...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGBM5vWiBLo

Seriously, the permanent magnets in the pickups are only there to magnetize the strings.  To generate electricity you have to move a magnet in coil.

That's why pure stainless steel strings will not work on an electric guitar's magnetic pickups.  They would last longer plated or coated strings because you wouldn't play them as much.
 
Hmm. I guess the stainless strings on my Strat have some 'splainin to do. Probably gonna hafta go back and bitch at some my electrical engineering professors, too. Dang. And I had already planned on building a Tele this week. Maybe making a lasagne... some meatball sammiches...
 
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